Saturday, December 16, 2006

Veiled threats end C4 Christmas message

It is reported in The Telegraph that the Muslim woman who was due to deliver Channel 4's alternative Christmas message wearing a niqab has cancelled her appearance. Apparently, she received criticism from inside and outside her community.

According to the report, ‘she had been pressurised by senior members of the community who felt it was not her place to talk about Islam. It has also been said that she had received threatening letters from non-Muslims accusing her of trying to upstage the Queen’.

The second reason is a little puzzling, given that the very raison d’être of this slot is to upstage Her Majesty, and letters of complaint about Quentin Crisp and Sharon Osborne in previous years were quite ineffectual. The first reason, however, is more than a little revealing about the nature of Islam – it is simply not a woman’s place to talk about its beliefs or practices, and pressure has been applied by 'senior Muslims’ to force her withdrawal. One wonders who these people are and what they threatened.

But Cranmer is baffled by this announcement, and can’t help thinking it is all a further publicity stunt to boost viewing figures. Given that no face would be visible, and no-one would see lips move, anyone could front this programme while any woman read the message. In fact, C4 could even have asked Cranmer to deliver this message, his vast beard concealed beneath a niqab, and kept all of this embarrassing coverage out of the media altogether…

30 Comments:

Anonymous Voyager said...

Cold feet...........if only all women so attired suffered from this characteristic how much better things would be.

16 December 2006 at 12:10  
Anonymous Colin said...

His Grace,

"C4 could even have asked Cranmer to deliver this message"

Actually, I thought that they did.
Did they and His Grace got cold feet?

16 December 2006 at 12:59  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Even though she is wearing the veil I can tell she's a minger.
Probably best for all us red blooded males that she keeps it on.

16 December 2006 at 15:34  
Anonymous Dexey said...

Your Grace wrote ..."and letters of complaint about Quentin Crisp and Sharon Osborne in previous years were quite ineffectual."

but were the letters direct to Quentin and Sharon and threatening?

Peter Hitchens said...
Even though she is wearing the veil I can tell she's a minger.
Probably best for all us red blooded males that she keeps it on.

3:34 PM


I have heard "Bib" ... better, or best, in a burka applied to non muslims.

16 December 2006 at 17:15  
Anonymous Colin said...

Peter,

Googling for minger I found her pic without a veil.

16 December 2006 at 17:15  
Blogger Cranmer said...

but were the letters direct to Quentin and Sharon and threatening?

Ms Dexey,

The letters in previous years were sent both to C4 and their celebrity guests. Those to Mr Crisp were unpleasant, yet simply strengthened his resolve. One might imagine that Mrs Osborne is made of still sterner stuff. Perhaps most importantly, Mr Crisp received no threats from 'senior homosexuals', and Mrs Osborne no threats from 'senior wives of well-past-it rockers'.

16 December 2006 at 17:44  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

colin (+:
I recall seeing a lady walking along Kilburn high road last year wearing a veil, gloves, spray on trousers, a very tight shirt and jacket finished off with high heel boots.
I have to say the effect was quite sexy. Bet she wouldnt dare wear that In saudi.

16 December 2006 at 18:01  
Blogger wrinkled weasel said...

I wonder if His Grace was found recently in the back of a Merc, declaring, "I'm the incarnate form of a 500 year-old martyr -it's what I do".

16 December 2006 at 18:12  
Anonymous Voyager said...

Wrinkled Weasael obviously does not know the chasm that separates the incumbent Bishop of Southwark from the historical Archbishop Cranmer..............in both theology and orthodoxy.

Southwark is London's 'Little Red House' of devoted deviancy.......but for Archbishop Carey the current nonentity as A of C would have it on his CV too

16 December 2006 at 18:26  
Blogger wrinkled weasel said...

Yes, yes I know all that. I was teasing. Southwark is despised, among other things, for refusing to ordain evangelicals. His Grace has (had) impeccable credentials apart from, ahem, shall we say being more of a pragmatist than a Tyndale or a Coverdale. Nothing wrong with being a pragmatist. In those days it meant you lasted a bit longer.

16 December 2006 at 18:33  
Anonymous Colin said...

Peter,

"I recall seeing a lady walking along Kilburn high road last year wearing a veil, gloves, spray on trousers, a very tight shirt and jacket finished off with high heel boots."

Obviously, such a combination is able to make a lasting impression. Maybe the veil will become the favorite dress for Western women with a less than perfect face.

16 December 2006 at 19:45  
Blogger istanbultory said...

well, exactly your Grace. Women are expressly prohibited from any role in spreading the "faith" in Islam. In North America and Britain, many muslim women are banished to basement rooms or banned from the mosque entirely.Most mosques don't allow women any chance to speak and be heard, let alone have any say in the way the mosque is run.

I have heard told that His Grace was notable by his absence from the Dale/Fawkes Yule Tide shindig. One assumes that decadence runs counter to Cranmer's profound moral rectitude.

16 December 2006 at 19:51  
Anonymous Colin said...

Istanbultory,

Did you pay for a flight to attend this celebrity meeting?

16 December 2006 at 20:19  
Blogger istanbultory said...

Alas, Colin, I was uninvited. Like His Grace, I too frown upon inebriation and vice. So would not have attended in any case.

16 December 2006 at 20:38  
Blogger Cranmer said...

Mr Istanbultory,

His Grace did indeed send his sincere apologies to Mr Dale and the papist Fawkes. It was not that he frowns upon such festive gatherings, but rather that his present incorporeal state rather precluded an incarnate manifestation.

16 December 2006 at 20:49  
Anonymous Voyager said...

Yes Your Grace, I think Fawkes has made a speedier recovery from being hanged, drawn, and quartered than yourself in rising from the ashes...........but obviously the exertions made Fawkes more inclined towards a stiff drink

16 December 2006 at 21:16  
Blogger Cranmer said...

Mr Voyager,

At least Mr Fawkes' body parts were all present after his trauma, thus facilitating resurrection. As the Mohammedans are aware, it is rather more difficult reconstituting ashes, even if they were to be mingled with alcohol.

16 December 2006 at 21:25  
Anonymous Colin said...

Istanbultory,

" I was uninvited "

I am sorry to hear that. But I guess that the hosts didn't want you to carry the burden of traveling such a large distance and of paying yourself for the flight.

16 December 2006 at 23:53  
Blogger Newmania said...

I have had a thought about this endless Mooslim bashing which is often the thinly disguised purpose of his your Graces righteous ardour . I keep press cutting s in neatly filed sections under such headings as Education , the Economy and so on . The file dealing with Islam is rapidly approaching the same size as the rest combined . I notice on Guido (when I have a second from work) , that seething masses swarm upon the subject like ants to a carcase . Now why should this be . Yes they are irritating but so are many other things .

I believe that it is not so much a wish to abuse and denigrate Islam (laudable enough in itself IMHO ) but a wish to reassert our own national identity through the expulsion of an outsider. There is a very long tradition of such activities and clearly it must be the tribes first instincts to recombine when “the centre will not hold”. I believe the panic and horror of Muslims springs from the tribes instinctive need to recombine . This is not surprising .The Blair years have decimated the vertical institutions of the country ghettoised what was the working class and fragmented everything that once held us together.

I wonder if we need an enemy and to some extent they are comfort rivals in this country.

In Shakespeare`s comedic resolutions are often accompanied by the expulsion of an outisider...a scapegoat. Given that the origins of drama may well be in precogniscant liturgical ritual, I find this highly suggestive of the human condition.


In short are they part of an ancient need for sacrifice echoed to this day in the communion.

( Are we magic body or Sunblest folk here BTW?)

16 December 2006 at 23:54  
Blogger Newmania said...

ahem I would like to with draw the phrase"Thinly disguised Mooslim bashing " and replace it with "Sensitivity to alien Cultural groups being given unduly preferential treatment"

17 December 2006 at 00:11  
Anonymous Voyager said...

Bethlehem

Hardly likely Channel 4 will offer any support to these Palestinians

17 December 2006 at 07:11  
Anonymous Voyager said...

School

This is where Channel 4's niqabed woman 'teaches' in a private school with unqualified 'teachers'............that schools like this exist is a farce and the government thinks it can bring them into the OFSTED regime and National Curriulum by funding them..............far better would be to close them down for failing to meet standards - and ban instruction in any language but English

17 December 2006 at 11:05  
Blogger shergar said...

Given that no face would be visible...

Had his Grace taken the time to read the bumper Christmas edition of Private Eye, he may have noticed the classified advertisement for X-ray veil specs. The endorsement from Jack Straw, of Blackburn, reads: "If only I'd had my X-ray veil specs, I would have saved myself a lot of trouble."

17 December 2006 at 14:02  
Anonymous Colin said...

Newmania,

Coincidentally, I just posted a comment on Instanbultory's blog similar to your 11:54 PM comment above. I wrote:

"Anonym,

You wrote not words of reason but of hate, i.e. ”in my opinion, Muslims are the trash of humanity. tell me just one redeeming characteristic for these people? I can't think of any. They are lying, war mongering hate filled people with no observable conscience or regret.”

I beg to differ. I know several Muslims and their families. They are not different from you or me. A redeeming characteristic is their strong sense of family values.

They are not more lying than the others. Their politicians are lying but so are ours.

In regard to your claim that they are war mongering, please permit me to remind you that the socialist countries killed an estimated 100 million human beings in the 20th century. Considerably less were killed by Muslims.

Concerning your accusation ”with no observable conscience or regret”, I never observed conscience or regret for the killings of innocents by among others Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Churchill, GW, TB or did you?

The sad fact is that there is not much difference and that all humans tend to identify with their own group, to apologise their most horrible actions and to demonise the members of other groups.

Politicians like to stimulate these sentiments because it enables them to divide and rule."

Newmania,

Your hypothesis of an instinct is certainly correct. Professor Robert Axelrod has done some research on the evolutionary advantage of ethnocentric behavior and found "that ethnocentric behavior can emerge from a simple evolutionary model of local competition between individuals...When cooperating is relatively costly, ethnocentric behavior can even be necessary to sustain cooperation." here.

The Muslims are not evil per se as several bloggers claim but are also victims of this instinctive behavior and see the members of the other groups as untrustworthy. The result is reciprocal aggression which leads to the unfortunate need to stay within one own's group for security reasons.

18 December 2006 at 00:19  
Blogger Newmania said...

Colin how nice of you to notice me .The only problem with the tempting path of "understanding and therefore forgiving" is that it renders the understander incapable of making judgements about groups.
I will not accept that individuals and their sum , the group, are not responsible for their behaviour whatever pressures are upon them . The growth such relativist notions has had a damaging effect on those who most require a firm moral framework . Its easy to fall into a sea of paradox but let me offer a concrete example.
It is common to blame the culture, legal framework, and ,(supposed), under resourced facilities of the Met for their failings . Also for their disinterest in anything but producing fraudulent statistics.
To some extent perhaps this is true however it is also true that the police are lazy morally corrupt and self serving. For good people to accept that it is the fault of “institutional …whatever” is to step back from the solution . Part of that solution must be from within.

I worry at the sheer bulk of anti Islamic comment in the right wing press , when you gather it together it makes a horrifying pile of hate that the objective will not sustain. That was why I was wondering about other reasons. This does not excuse Islam which I detest.

Now I will have look at your kindly mentioned link which I should have done before

18 December 2006 at 01:32  
Blogger Newmania said...

Incidentally Colin Northern Ireland is full of Loving and reasonable people who vote for Sinn Fein in the full knowledge and tacit acceptance of the violence perpetrated ion their behalf. If their own families and Mosques did not know the bombers then why would you and how much do you know what their motivations at different levels may be.? I have great doubts that the dove Muslim is the overwhelming majority .I could find some disturbing survey evidence

~(This would be amongst the distressing pile of hate…I know I know )

(fascinating Link!!)

18 December 2006 at 01:39  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Colin said...

Newmania,

Coincidentally, I just posted a comment on Instanbultory's blog similar to your 11:54 PM comment above. I wrote:

"Anonym,

You wrote not words of reason but of hate, i.e. ”in my opinion, Muslims are the trash of humanity. tell me just one redeeming characteristic for these people? I can't think of any. They are lying, war mongering hate filled people with no observable conscience or regret.”



If you look at Istanbul Tory Blog Colin you will note that this quotation is actually one originally made by Kahraman who in its original form had the word "Neo-Cons" where "Muslim" was substituted

18 December 2006 at 07:28  
Anonymous Colin said...

"Colin how nice of you to notice me .The only problem with the tempting path of "understanding and therefore forgiving" is that it renders the understander incapable of making judgements about groups."

Newmania, I always notice your interesting comments and I mostly agree with you. Also this time, I can't find anything in your comments to disagree with. Maybe there is a misunderstanding because I didn't express myself clearly. My comment was an attempt to explain the cause of a widespread 'disease', i.e. ethnocentrism, which has killed millions of people in the course of human history and predictably will do so in the future. The question is how can this be prevented? Forgiving doesn't solve the problems we have with psychopaths trying dominate others. Approximately 1 percent of any population in the world belong to this category and it is a highly heritable personality trait.

What are the charateristics of psychopaths? Dr. Robert D. Hare is the world expert and explained in his book Without Conscience - The Disturbing World of the Psychopaths Among Us: "Individuals with this personality disorder are fully aware of the consequences of their actions and know the difference between right and wrong, yet they are terrifyingly self-centered, remorseless, and unable to care about the feelings of others. Perhaps most frightening, they often seem completely normal to unsuspecting targets--and they do not always ply their trade by killing. Presenting a compelling portrait of these dangerous men and women based on 25 years of distinguished scientific research, Dr. Robert D. Hare vividly describes a world of con artists, hustlers, rapists, and other predators who charm, lie, and manipulate their way through life."

If you first read Dr. Hare's book and then the biographies of politicians such as Hitler, Stalin, Churchill or Jung Chang's "Mao - The Untold Story and many others you will experience a deja-vu.

"Terrifyingly self-centered, .. and unable to care about the feelings of others", European politicians are trying to social-engineer a new nation for the purpose of building an EU empire. And for the purpose of getting their hands on the oil fields of the Middle East, they are importing millions of poor people from the Islamic world who resent the Western way of life. Naturally, the 1 percent psychopaths among them will act without conscience in their attempts to dominate others by terrorism. Unfortunately, the outcome is likely to be a civil war because nearly all multicultural empires have fallen apart as a consequence of civil wars, e.g. the Austrian-Hungarian empire, the Sovjet empire, Yugoslavia ... In order to save their empire, the governments of multicultural empires have to control and coerce everybody leading to a totalitarian regime. Since I love peace, freedom and other cultures, I am against the planned EU empire and its coercive multiculturalism. Hopefully, I expressed myself more clearly this time.

18 December 2006 at 13:19  
Blogger Newmania said...

Colin I enjoyed that . Have you by any chnane noticed the problems that have come from the outing of JHL as a convicted Axe Murderer. Some of what you say is eerily apposite

19 December 2006 at 21:40  
Anonymous Colin said...

Newmania,

I am glad that you liked it. Unfortunately, I am not aware of the outing of JHL as a convicted Axe Murderer. However, Dr. Hare appears to confirm your diagnosis since he wrote that to his knowledge nearly all the serial murderers are psychopaths. He also wrote that psychopaths are attracted by power and can be found not infrequently among top managers and strock brokers. Since PM, chancellor, president etc. are the most powerful positions of society, we would expect that a few of them to fit the description, wouldn't we. A famous psychiatrist, Ernst Kretschmer, wrote that especially in time of crisis they rule us.

21 December 2006 at 20:29  

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