Tuesday, December 21, 2010

Pope Benedict: “The sun is setting over an entire world.”

As it was in the days of Noah, as it was at the fall of the Roman Empire, so is it today.

In his traditional Christmas greeting to the Roman Curia, Pope Benedict XVI expounded the parallels between the social upheaval, political chaos and moral vacuum which constitute the modern era, and those which precipitated the fall of the Roman Empire. He concluded as did the apocalyptic prophets of old: “The very future of the world is at stake.”

And he exhorts believers as the Psalmist did: “There was no power in sight that could put a stop to this decline. All the more insistent, then, was the invocation of the power of God: the plea that he might come and protect his people from all these threats.”

An impotent and absent God seems to have forsaken the world at the time of tribulation.

Describing the decline of the Roman Empire, the Pope noted: “The disintegration of the key principles of law and of the fundamental moral attitudes underpinning them burst open the dams which until that time had protected peaceful coexistence among peoples.

“The sun was setting over an entire world,” he continued. “Frequent natural disasters further increased this sense of insecurity. There was no power in sight that could put a stop to this decline.”

Comparing the empire of Rome to the modern of one of Europa, he said: “For all its new hopes and possibilities, our world is at the same time troubled by the sense that moral consensus is collapsing, consensus without which juridical and political structures cannot function. Consequently the forces mobilized for the defence of such structures seem doomed to failure.”

The leitmotif of the address was unavoidably the numerous incidences of priestly sexual abuse of children and their systematic cover-up, which he referred to as ‘the great tribulations to which we have been exposed during the past year’.

2010 was designated by the Pope as the ‘Year of the Priests’, and it certainly was, but for all the wrong reasons: “We were all the more dismayed, then, when in this year of all years and to a degree we could not have imagined, we came to know of abuse of minors committed by priests who twist the sacrament into its antithesis, and under the mantle of the sacred profoundly wound human persons in their childhood, damaging them for a whole lifetime.”

In that dismay one senses a profound anger simmering beneath this pontificate. While the Pope spoke of the need for the Church to reflect upon its own inner workings to determine how such an evil could have become so endemic, he felt it was mitigated in the context of the moral disintegration of wider society, and he referred specifically to the ubiquity of child pornography, sex trafficking, drug abuse and ‘the tyranny of mammon’, saying, “No pleasure is ever enough, and the excess of deceiving intoxication becomes a violence that tears whole regions apart – and all this in the name of a fatal misunderstanding of freedom which actually undermines man’s freedom and ultimately destroys it.”

And he recounted a vision which brings to mind that given to the Apostle John on Patmos:
In the year of our Lord’s incarnation 1170, I had been lying on my sick-bed for a long time when, fully conscious in body and in mind, I had a vision of a woman of such beauty that the human mind is unable to comprehend. She stretched in height from earth to heaven. Her face shone with exceeding brightness and her gaze was fixed on heaven. She was dressed in a dazzling robe of white silk and draped in a cloak, adorned with stones of great price. On her feet she wore shoes of onyx. But her face was stained with dust, her robe was ripped down the right side, her cloak had lost its sheen of beauty and her shoes had been blackened. And she herself, in a voice loud with sorrow, was calling to the heights of heaven, saying, ‘Hear, heaven, how my face is sullied; mourn, earth, that my robe is torn; tremble, abyss, because my shoes are blackened!’
Pope Benedict is clear: the stain of dust is the rape of innocence; the torn garments are the sins of priests.

The only solution, he avers, is to stand against relativism, and the warping of the idea of the conscience: “In order to resist these forces, we must turn our attention to their ideological foundations. In the 1970s, paedophilia was theorized as something fully in conformity with man and even with children. This, however, was part of a fundamental perversion of the concept of ethos. It was maintained – even within the realm of Catholic theology – that there is no such thing as evil in itself or good in itself. There is only a ‘better than’ and a ‘worse than’. Nothing is good or bad in itself. Everything depends on the circumstances and on the end in view. Anything can be good or also bad, depending upon purposes and circumstances. Morality is replaced by a calculus of consequences, and in the process it ceases to exist. The effects of such theories are evident today.”

Perhaps in the observation ‘even within the realm of Catholic theology’ is a swipe at the modernisers, the liberals, and the unintended consequences of Vatican II.

In talking of his visit to the UK, His Grace was struck by this quote from the Blessed John Henry Cardinal Newman:
In January 1863 he wrote in his diary these distressing words: “As a Protestant, I felt my religion dreary, but not my life - but, as a Catholic, my life dreary, not my religion.”
It would appear that he never experienced the profound joy at the heart of the Anglican expression of Protestantism. And doubtless some of His Grace’s readers and communicants might also insist, if his life were ‘dreary’, that he never tasted Catholicism.

The Pope also called on political leaders to ‘put a stop to Christianophobia’.

But it is not clear how they may do so in the era of omnipotent ‘Human Rights’, in which all religions are equal and the mere offer of prayer may mean instant dismissal from one’s job, and the proclamation of Christian orthodoxy may lead to economic hardship, arrest, fines and even imprisonment.

In the final analysis, the Pope observed that ‘only if there is…a consensus on the essentials can constitutions and law function’.

So quite why he supports the emerging Empire of Europa, in which there is no consensus and no accountability to the demos, is a mystery. There may indeed be public agreement on essential truths which are ‘derived from the Christian heritage’, but in the secular and Godless EU this heritage is ignored and morality is subsumed in the pursuit of ever secular union.

He concluded: “To resist this eclipse of reason and to preserve its capacity for seeing the essential, for seeing God and man, for seeing what is good and what is true, is the common interest that must unite all people of good will. The very future of the world is at stake.”

Indeed it is.

Excita, Domine, potentiam tuam, et veni.

63 Comments:

Blogger Gawain Towler said...

Good Question your Grace, very good question. The Praetorian Guard of Comece seem to be the problem

21 December 2010 at 11:06  
Anonymous bluedog said...

Weltschmerz, Your Grace, weltschmerz. A good man and a fine theologian, but these are the words of an old, tired and dispirited man. Perhaps Benedict is preparing us for his departure.

21 December 2010 at 11:16  
Blogger Preacher said...

Is it possible that Mr R is going to accept that the fancy dress party is over & repent & be saved? I hope so.
Then perhaps the Lord will hear the cry of all The believers & send His Holy Spirit to produce a revival that will reach to the furthest points of the compass.

21 December 2010 at 12:01  
Anonymous Greg Tingey said...

Obviously, if Ratzinger wants to re-empahsize "Moral" values, he needs to find some deeply unpleasant fascist regimes to cuddle up to ...
Same as the (Roman) catholic church always did on the past .....

21 December 2010 at 12:31  
Blogger Bred in the bone said...

He means nobody is entertained by traditional Club of Rome Eucharist and Circus.

Here is something good and true to unite us, Lord of the Rings.

Anglo Saxon word ring means a circle, latin circus, derived from Sanskrit chakra as in Dharma Wheel.

"According to all religions, Dharma is as illimitable in its juridiction as the Lord Almighty Himself" said Guruji when being tried for Sedition against the British Raj

Only when we accept the Ten Kindoms in Daniel are symbolic of the Battle in the Vedic Ten Kings and King David is taken from Divodasa in the Defeat of the Dasyus, can the spiritual enlightened peoples unite in common ground with Truth of Aryan Culture.

Just as the Promised Land is in the Mind, like was the Seven sisters taking water to Jethro at the Well where Moses stopped in the Land of Midian.

Lets stop accepting Metaphor for fact.
* * *
The words of the law are garments, in which it is clothed. Wo to him who takes the garment of the law for the law itself- Zohar

Continued Judeo-Christian unity is dependant on Vedic-Cabalist spiritual unity.

21 December 2010 at 12:56  
Anonymous Oswin said...

It is interesting, that during this time of great tribulation, that so few appear aware of its existence; and those that do, are branded anathema.

21 December 2010 at 13:01  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Complaints, complaints. And yet, consider this: http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/12/21/preacher-wins-7000-after-being-wrongly-arrested-for-homophobia/
and this:
http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/12/10/anti-gay-christian-preacher-wins-4000-compensation-for-arrest/

When these cases began, His Grace made much complaint of the intolerant nature of our society. Do these compensation payments calm him, persuading him that the system works?

21 December 2010 at 14:18  
Blogger Graham Davis said...

Moral vacuum!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The moral vacuum is within the Catholic Church not outside it. The man is a disgrace!

21 December 2010 at 15:13  
Anonymous Bede said...

In nazi Germany, many so-called Christians collaborated with the regime (as in the rest of Europe. But in Germany, it was noticeable that (except for certain heroic individuals) the Protestant Churches collaborated much more than did the Catholic Church - though there were many exceptions to this among Catholics. See Michael Burleigh's 'The Third Reich: A New History'.

21 December 2010 at 15:38  
OpenID yokel said...

Cranmer wrote: "An impotent and absent God seems to have forsaken the world at the time of tribulation."

It could be that God has noticed that we (the human race) have been busy chasing Him out of just about everything, and as though He might have said to Himself "I wonder how they would get on if I really did leave them alone as they ask?"

But then, being God he knew ages ago. That's why Jesus spoke the words in Matthew 24:37.

21 December 2010 at 16:49  
Anonymous Oswin said...

Quite right Yokel, I doubt we hold many surprises for God.

21 December 2010 at 16:53  
Anonymous John Knox said...

Your Grace,
Do you read excita as abandon or appear?

21 December 2010 at 16:59  
Anonymous Voyager said...

Well Bede aside from your desire to introduce Nazism into the discussion I really do not see how your comment adds to the discussion. If you reflect on the year 1923 and the Communist uprisings in Germany supported by Stalin and the invasion by France and Belgium, you might get a sense of nationalism being a reaction to deconstruction of German identity.

As for The Pope. He makes sense. Only by standing apart from the world and its peculiarities can on hope to find a bearing. The headlong flight into destruction seems to be driven by media and politics with too many fellow-travellers.

The EU is simply a Communist construct from Spinelli and a Fascist one from Monnet staffed by 68'ers. It has no answers beyond accretion of power.

In a world of empty suits it is a struggle to find driftwood of substance to hang onto

21 December 2010 at 17:24  
Anonymous Atlas shrugged said...

So quite why he supports the emerging Empire of Europa, in which there is no consensus and no accountability to the demos, is a mystery.

Yet it is only a mystery if you have not been paying any type of proper attention to many of my comments on this particular matter.

The powers that be, very much includes The RCC, and all that goes with it. The exact same powers that be that created the EU in the first place, and who have been secretly or otherwise propagating it ever since.

Apart from the above being a matter of record, there exists an even simpler way of understanding our current situation.

When something happens, that you don't understand either why it happened, or who is behind it. Like for example, seemingly uncontrollable street rioting, or economic chaos, The Watergate Scandal, or The Kennedy assassination, you first look to identify that which had the power to STOP the event happening in the first place. Once you work out who or what had such power, chances are you need look no further, or you are at least getting very close to the truth.

After all do you really think the EU would have got past it's planning stage, never mind got as far as it has, if The RCC and its countless millions of devoted followers, were ever substantively against The EU, and all that goes with it?

Of course not, and neither would the Nazi Party ever gained control of Germany's Parliament, if The RCC had not been openly, as well as otherwise backing it.

It is good to see that your grace knows truth when he sees it, and also understands why The TRUTH matters.

If you believe things are bad, not only are things self-evidently bad but they have a habit of getting worse. Therefore remaining generally positive and optimistic is as a rule, an essential step towards a continual healthy spiritual and material existence.

However when the people who have the power to make things better, say that things are bad, then things will not only get much worse, the people with the power will make absolutely certain that they do exactly that.

21 December 2010 at 17:31  
Anonymous not a machine said...

His holiness may be outlining somthing very important , if in rather pessimistic and forboding language. Concience is somthing which governments , once used to describe the more intricate understandings of human life.

However things have been changing for some time in concience and its quality . It is difficult to look back and see where we took on board somthing that would begin to change our concepts and perhaps belief about our lives in time .
Eienstien noted that time slowed the faster you went .
I sometimes wonder if we are obscurring god by the way we now live our lives , as the moral economy of the mind has changed so much . So much comes to us from the hectic media outside , any contemplation on the more engrossing thoughts of the realtions of our lives , is corrupted/tresspassed by the desires or fears of loss of being or not being part of it.
In some ways the conscience is been downgraded as it no longer runs in a life honouring way .We shop silently bar the piped tunes and the required intense browsing .

A man of sorrows is not always welcome , but it can often be when you are struggling or as St Paul described wrestling with somthing on the periphery of perception.

If we are to be bound by numbers instead of language at the level of human understanding and scale , then we will no longer transfere the values of christianity into the future generation , we will treat each other differently , goverments will behave differently . There are many who would be quite happy to see our foundational christian reference swept away , as the question about keeping it is so poorly defended , we have the words but no longer see the origin or the source .

The bible tells of of many times when despite the odds , people prayed , gained pure hearts , and sought the lord and were not double minded, and the covenant was restored and the wrath receeded.
The lord sees our earnest prayers , our real tears and if our love is true .
The only answer is to seek the lord , only his wisdom will give the righteous the strength and words to serve .
Personally I prefere the old communion service , which carries that requirement to come unto the alter with a more thoughtfull approach .

His holiness now sees the damaged conscience , the repair perhaps will take as long and as much trouble as the road it went down to damage it , I hope and pray his holiness and others with position find prayer to be of help in discerning this most difficult of matters and questions about ourselves and our lives .

21 December 2010 at 18:03  
Anonymous Budgie said...

We would have been much less troubled by "paedophiles", including the priestly variety, if the Moors murderers and the the Wests had been hanged.

21 December 2010 at 18:22  
Blogger Johnny Rottenborough said...

in this year of all years [2010] and to a degree we could not have imagined, we came to know of abuse of minors committed by priests

The Papal memory must be playing tricks. As The Times pointed out earlier this year: ‘… it was Pope Benedict himself who, as head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith—the successor to the Inquisition—imposed secrecy on sex abuse cases in 2001’.

he felt [sex abuse] was mitigated in the context of the moral disintegration of wider society

A pretty disgusting excuse, Your Holiness.

21 December 2010 at 18:25  
Anonymous non mouse said...

Yes, Yokel and Oswin. I'm with you and Boethius on the view of the Omniscient Omnipresent! We have Free Will, but His View of it-and its consequences- is both Perpetual and Infinite.

So as we crawl around our atom of dust, in less than a blink of His eye...

21 December 2010 at 18:43  
Anonymous JayBee said...

So quite why he supports the emerging Empire of Europa, in which there is no consensus and no accountability to the demos, is a mystery...........

Any dream of the EU becoming a Holy European Empire must be fading fast. No wonder the Pope seems a bit down. The Vatican is but a speck in the European landmass. His little citadel is encircled by a EU that has no room for God.
There will be no Holy European Emperor. The rock on which the EU is built is not Peter. It is the European currency. “Thou art Euro and on this Euro I will build Europe” boasted Pedro Solbes the Spanish Finance Minister. Thus the doctrines of the Roman Church are sidelined in favour of the secular ideology of relativism and the tyranny of mammon.
The Pope supported the EU because of visions of religo-political power and imperialist aims to overwhelm Protestant enclaves. He cannot now escape from it because the Vatican is imprisoned monetarily. The Euro “rock” was nothing of the kind and the Eurozone is looking more like a “house built on sand” and forecast to disintegrate. I wonder what religo-political landscape will emerge from the chaos.

21 December 2010 at 20:18  
Anonymous len said...

For once I am in total agreement with the Pope, this World is staggering towards an upheaval not seen since the days of Noah.
It seems that forces have been put into action from which there is no turning back.
God is far from impotent and not absent, He has made His objectives clear through His Word.
It is perhaps time to review our situations and determine whether our 'houses'are built on the rock(Christ)or shifting sand. The Reign of man is coming to a close.
Maranatha.

21 December 2010 at 20:44  
Anonymous Anglican and proud thereof said...

To your last invocation, Your Grace:

Amen.

21 December 2010 at 21:52  
Anonymous Atlas shrugged said...

The Reign of man is coming to a close.
Maranatha.

21 December 2010 20:44

Not at all.

The Reign of man, never really existed, therefore it cannot come to a close.

What may be a more accurate statement might be. The illusion of the Reign of man, namely democracy, is coming to an end.

You only have dominion over your eternal soul. It is yours, nobody else's, it is all you have, and all you will ever have. I suggest you look after it, because NO ONE else will.

If you put your trust into others, Popes, priests, politicians, kings, despots, scientists, theologians, journalist, or indeed anyone else, quite frankly you deserve what you have well and truly got.

Trust not those that say they have found the truth, trust more those that say they are seeking, that which they know can never be found.

If anyone, repeat ANYONE tells you anything whatsoever about the true nature of GOD, that makes sense at all, then they have truly showed that they don't know the first thing about the true nature of anything of the kind.

For the true nature of GOD is not stranger then you imagine, it is not stranger then you could possibly imagine.

The truth about the true nature of GOD is stranger then you could possibly even begin to imagine, and certainly not while you remain imprisoned at this sublunary abode.

21 December 2010 at 21:58  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Atlas shrugged said 21 December 2010 21:58

Ah..At last, a student of the school of philosophy of Dr Seuss.

However as you have not bothered to elaborate or define your 'pearls of wisdom' let me show my prowess too. I am a black belt 9th dan..

The wise old man posed a question to the young student holding up the world and all it's problems uoon his shoulders..

'Pupil, you have much to learn, consider this and explain it.

If it takes a fish a week to fly a fortnight, how long does it take a spider with a broken leg to crawl through a barrel of treacle.

The young student just shrugged and pondered and pondered..'

Is not philosophy a strange and mysterious thing...Right, I'm off to read my Bible where the nature of God is KNOWABLE as he declares it as such and offers to reason with me about it, stating He rewards those who diligently seek Him, it so I CAN KNOW HIM.

However, Atlas shrugged, the Mystery of God, AH, now THAT is another thing???

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

21 December 2010 at 22:53  
Blogger Bred in the bone said...

Atlas shrugged has an ideology based on ancestral knowledge that Indic folk suffered a huge persecution, that is the fact a thousand years back or there abouts, we were robbed of our true culture, because the Church had a War on Indic beliefs.

Now some would say the State-Church never had such a battle, rather what happened was a deliberate hoax, in which just the common folk got targeted as witches and certain Aristo retained for themselves our ancestral knowledge, a kind of Elite Club.

I would say they retained it for when a World would again come to see the Light and the Order of the Garter, though a mischeivous bunch need a jolly good spanking. WHAT! WHAT!

Come now I see the Light, you Minx you, now chase me, why I turn off the lights and on again!

WOW! Look is that not wonderful, I am magic, everyone depends upon the Power Stations I control.

Because I am a dumb insolent fool!

21 December 2010 at 23:58  
Anonymous len said...

Atlas Shrugged,
God revealed Himself to Mankind through His Word.
Therefore God is knowable.
The Reign of fallen man is displayed throughout History and is evident everywhere today.
You seem to live in a strange vacuum insulated from reality.
The soul of a fallen man is not free at all,his freedom is an illusion ,buthe is in bondage to sin and the author of sin.

21 December 2010 at 23:59  
Blogger Owl said...

The Catholic church is being attacked on all sides, it seems.
Everyone is dragging every skeleton in the cupboard into the light of day. A negative orgy.
The only defense, it seems, is one frail old man already marked by his own past.

Clean up the church by all means.

I am glad that my fellow countrymen led the fight to get this matter into the light. The Pedos have to be brought to justice and the people who covered up for them as well.

But.. we have lost sight completely of the positive sides.

In the dark ages it was Catholic priests and monks from Ireland who brought light back into the world, it was Mother Theresa who brought light to the hopeless children of India. There are many others that we have never heard of who are showing the real face of Christianity, without the politics.

Catholics and Protestants alike.

The EU would love to see the power of the Catholic church diminished as it is the only institution in the western that can resist the secular manipulations, when it chooses to do so. The EU cannot reign supreme until it has done so.

The EU is perfectly aware that the Church is it's greatest enemy. The EU is no different to the old USSR in this respect, and many others too.

When the Fabian society began it's gradually movement towards the brave new world it spawned the most evil society known to man.

The Eugenics movement.

G. K. Chesterton, almost single handedly, saved England from the worst atrocities. America has now to live with it.

He based his arguments on his beliefs, and moved a mountain.

No, do not believe the secularists that the church is on it's last legs and soon equality will now reign, well, for the chosen few anyway.

The social engineering required to get this far carries it's own destruction. The people are unfulfilled. They require God and will eventually reject the mess of pottage that they are being offered.

I once had the honour of meeting a teacher in Youghal Co. Cork. Her name is Sister Bridie and she was then getting on for seventy. She now teaches in Pakistan. This is someone in the same mold as Mother Theresa and I feel sorry for any radical Moslem that might object to her Christianity, or any humanist for that matter.

As long as these people exist, the future looks bright.

22 December 2010 at 00:05  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Owl said 22 December 2010 00:05
In the dark ages it was Catholic priests and monks from Ireland who brought light back into the world, WHERE/HOW, SHOW ME? NEXT YOU'LL BE TELLING ME WE ONLY GOT THE BIBLE BECAUSE OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH?
it was Mother Theresa who brought light to the hopeless children of India. HOW, SHE WATCHED THEM DIE, GOING TO ETERNAL SEPERATION FROM GOD, REFUSING TO DECLARE CHRIST AND HIS FORGIVENESS TO THEM IF THEY BELIEVE ON HIM. HOW IS THIS LIGHT?
The EU is perfectly aware that the Church is it's greatest enemy. YES, THE TRUE BODY OF CHRIST (ALL BELIEVERS WHO TRUST IN CHRIST'S SACRIFICE FOR A FULL SALVATION, WE ARE THE SALT OF THE EARTH) NOT AN EARTHLY RELIGION SEEKING TEMPORAL POWER OVER THE LIVES OF MEN AND WOMEN !

The Eugenics movement. G. K. Chesterton, almost single handedly, saved England from the worst atrocities. HE WAS AN EARLY CRITIC HOWEVER, THIS MOVEMENT STARTED LONG AGO.
ADOLF HITLER, WHO PRAISED AND INCORPORATED IDEAS IN 'MEIN KAMPF' AND EMULATED EUGENICS LEGISLATION FOR THE STERILISATION OF 'DEFECTIVES' BROUGHT CHURCH DOGMA TO IT'S NATURAL CONCLUSION.
HERE'S A FEW;
The Council of Vienne (1311) forbade all intercourse between Christians and Jews.
The Council of Zamora (1313) ruled that they must be kept in strict subjection and servitude.
The Council of Basel (1431-33) renewed canonical decrees forbidding Christians to associate with Jews, to serve them, or to use them as physicians, and instructed secular authorities to confine the Jews in separate quarters, compel them to wear a distinguishing badge, and ensure their attendance at sermons aimed to convert them.
Pope EugeniusIV...added that Jews should be ineligible for any public office, could not inherit property from Christians, must build no more synagogues, and...any Italian Jew found reading Talmudic literature should suffer confiscation of his property, etc.
Hmm, No wonder Hitler felt that he had good precedent for his sanctions against the Jews.

How well did C S Lewis reflect when he stated
'I believe that no man or group of men is good enough to be trusted with uncontrolled power over others. And the higher the pretensions of such power, the more dangerous I think it both to the rulers and to the subjects.

Hence Theocracy is the worst of all governments. If we must have a tyrant, a robber baron is far better than an inquisitor. The baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity at some point be sated; and since he dimly knows he is going wrong he may possibly repent.
But the inquisitor who mistakes his own cruelty and lust of power and fear for the voice of Heaven will torment us infinitely, because he torments us with the approval of his own conscience and his better impulses appear to him as temptations.
C.S. Lewis, "A Reply to Professor Haldane," in Of Other Worlds (Harcourt, Brace, World, 1967), page 81

This is someone in the same mold as Mother Theresa and I feel sorry for any radical Moslem that might object to her Christianity, or any humanist for that matter.' HOW WILL SHE THEREFORE BE ANY DIFFERENT FROM MOTHER THERESA? SEE ABOVE!

As long as these people exist, the future looks bright. PLEASE LORD, COME QUICKLY AND SAVE US!

22 December 2010 at 01:12  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

22 December 2010 at 02:31  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

Good God Almighty I cannot believe the hatred being expressed here towards his Holiness and the church of Rome.

Pope Benedict displayed great humility and profound insight in this address and yet many of you (you know who you are) just want to spew out poison.

Go hang your head in shame you 'Christians' displaying such appalling and destructive attitudes.

May God forgive you as you tear His message apart just as His robe was torn.

By the way Cranmer, I thought your blog excellent and well balanced.

22 December 2010 at 02:33  
Blogger Crusader said...

KingifHighCS

You really do talk AND SHOUT a load of nonsense.

Bet you're a lapsed Catholic trying to feel better. If you can't stay the course, blame the course -eh?

Grow up!

22 December 2010 at 02:43  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman 22 December 2010 02:33 Crusader 22 December 2010 02:43

Never any responses based on rebuttal of stated facts, only emotional rant. Do you know anything about Catholicism? SHOW ME?

Look at my blog sign, I am NO LAPSED CATHOLIC.. I hide nothing yet you both cannot face up to the history and facts of the same Church I was a member of and you both still are !!

Get some courage and facts and respond properly. Catholicism relies on empty arguments to justify itself.

DOES THIS SOUND LIKE REASONABLE?

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

22 December 2010 at 02:53  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

22 December 2010 at 16:07  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

kingofhighcs

Once a Catholic, always a Catholic.
An indelible mark on your soul from the day you were baptised.

Nice that you've taken heed, albeit not completely. of Crusader's admonition about your shouting too.

Unlike you I think it inappropriate and undignified to bandy the Words of Holy Scripture about as missiles of condemnation and thinly veiled hate.

Maybe one day, when I have time, I'll refer you to the specific texts, or summarise them, passing authority to the Apostles, as an organised community, to baptise, forgive sins, to commorate His Last Super and to develop a fuller understanding of His revelation.

However, I'm minded of my late dad's advice, may he rest in peace, not to caste pearls before swine!

22 December 2010 at 16:15  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

For some reason, in 1960, led by St John Lennon, the white race gave up. Breeding stopped as the pill and contraception and abortion were gradually seen as normal. Divorce and family break down followed. Sex was permitted ad libitum. Every act became sexualised.
In return, we got a low birth rate and immigration from other races, who brought their own ideas and morals and religions with them.
The dear old C of E fell in with all this and, as a result, is now on its very last legs.
The Catholics too are following on their heels.
And it is the same wherever the white races live - South Africa, Australia, UK, Canada: no priests, small congregations.
We all know this. We all know that it is very bad form to mention it.
We just hope to goodness that some of our ideas about civilized behaviour have rubbed off.

22 December 2010 at 19:43  
Anonymous len said...

Mt Eman,
I am somewhat curious about your defence of Catholicism and your allegiance to the Denomination.I am curious as to what makes one a Catholic?.
A hypothetical question(don`t have to answer of course)If your renounced Catholicism and the authority of the Catholic Church and the authority of the Pope and relied entirely on your faith in Jesus Christ and the Grace of God would you still consider yourself saved?
Just curious.

22 December 2010 at 19:46  
Anonymous bluedog said...

Anonymous @ 19.43, sad but true. We must pray that our children have more sense than us.

22 December 2010 at 20:02  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr EMAN said 22 December 2010 16:15

THIS IS HOW I EMPHASISE MY POINTS IF I ANSWER YOUR STATEMENTS IN SEGMENTS..
I have not toned down my style because of Crusader at all..Deluded?
'Once a Catholic, always a Catholic.' IS THIS THE SAME AS 'ONCE A FOOL, ALWAYS A FOOL' OR' THERE IS NO FOOL LIKE AN OLD FOOL'

;An indelible mark on your soul from the day you were baptised.'
GRACIOUSLY REMOVED BY THE VERY PRECIOUS BLOOD OF CHRIST.

'Nice that you've taken heed, albeit not completely. of Crusader's admonition about your shouting too. ' SEE ABOVE!

'Unlike you I think it inappropriate and undignified to bandy the Words of Holy Scripture about as missiles of condemnation and thinly veiled hate.'

2 TIMOTHY 3:16
All scripture [is] given by inspiration of God, and [is] profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: ASSEQUOR/UNDERSTAND?

'Maybe one day, when I have time,(YEAH, YEAH, YEAH) I'll refer you to the specific texts, or summarise them, passing authority to the Apostles, as an organised community, to baptise, forgive sins, to commorate His Last Super and to develop a fuller understanding of His revelation.'

IS THIS SOME UNIQUE, SECRET CATHOLICISM I AM UNAWARE OF.
OH DO TELL, AS, I THINK I TOLD YOU THIS, I WAS ONCE A CATHOLIC...

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

22 December 2010 at 23:00  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

IEN

Why on earth would I want to renounce Catholicism?

Who can tell as we stand before Christ and he searches our souls, who is 'saved'?

"'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the first and great commandment. A second likewise is this, 'You shall love your neighbour as yourself.' The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments."

I would never have the pride to presume or to judge how others or myself measure up to Christ's summary of God's law. As He looks us in the eye and judges whether we followed His beatitudes we can only Hope we are invited to stand on his right hand.

I do my best in my own way with the help and assistance of the church and it's sacrements.

Do your best!

Our journey is to Know God, to Love God and to Serve God. A good old Catholic notion.

22 December 2010 at 23:40  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

KINGOFHIGHCS

"YEAH, YEAH, YEAH"

Are you a fan of the early Beatles?

He loves you ...

22 December 2010 at 23:49  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

23 December 2010 at 00:18  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

23 December 2010 at 00:20  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

22 December 2010 23:40

"'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' This is the first and great commandment. A second likewise is this, 'You shall love your neighbour as yourself.' The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments."

You missed out the first BIT

Matthew 22:34-36

34 But when the Pharisees had heard that he had put the Sadducees to silence, they were gathered together.
35 Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying,
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law?

You FORGOT A FEW relating to the greatest commandment, let me assist!

Exodus 20:3-6

3 Do not have any other gods before me.
4 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me,
6 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.

'Our journey is to Know God, to Love God and to Serve God. A good old Catholic notion.'
YOU OBVIOUSLY TOOK A WRONG TURNING ON THAT JOURNEY OF YOUR'S, WHEREAS I WENT BY THE STRAIT AND NARROW AND ARRIVED SAFELY IN MY SAVIOURS PROMISED REST!!

'He loves you ...' I KNOW, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY 'DO YOU LOVE HIM'. A GOOD OLD CATHOLIC NOTION?

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 00:22  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

Before becoming lost in the diabolical philosohies of the East and drugs.

John Lennon:

Say the word and you'll be free
Say the word and be like me
Say the word I'm thinking of
Have you heard the word is love?

It's so fine,
It's sunshine
It's the word, love

Spread the word and you'll be free
Spread the word and be like be
Spread the work I'm thinking of
Have you heard the word is love?

It's so fine,
It's sunshine
It's the word, love

Give the word a chance to say
That the word is just the way
It's the word I'm thinking of
And the only word is love

It's so fine,
It's sunshine
It's the word, love

Say the word and you'll be free
Say the word and be like me
Say the word I'm thinking of
Have you heard the word is love?

It's so fine,
It's sunshine
It's the word, love.

We hope you found your way Home.
Rest in Peace, John.

23 December 2010 00:20

23 December 2010 at 00:27  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman said 23 December 2010 00:20

Shame you removed your tribute to a foolish sinner and 'antichrist',stated in Lennon's own words!!! How very revealing!

I love a better, Christian Writer.

When I survey the wondrous cross on which the Prince of Glory died;
my richest gain I count but loss,
and pour contempt on all my pride.

Forbid it, Lord, that I should boast, save in the death of Christ, my God; all the vain things that charm me most,I sacrifice them to his blood.

See, from his head, his hands, his feet,sorrow and love flow mingled down.Did e'er such love and sorrow meet,or thorns compose so rich a crown.

Were the whole realm of nature mine, that were an offering far too small; love so amazing, so divine, demands my soul, my life, my all.

Thank You Lord Jesus, Forever In Your Debt..Your Beloved Redeemed.

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 00:31  
Blogger Dick the Prick said...

Your Grace

Did you write this?

It's a gig - someone's gotta do it

DtP

23 December 2010 at 06:50  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

HIGHANDMIGHTY

You really are a narrow minded and unloving man, with little compassion in your heart.

Who gives you the right of deciding who is and who is not the'anti-christ'? Who gives you the right to determine who is saved and who is 'damned'?

Do you suppose in your pride and self rightousness to know the Mind of God? To know who Our Saviour and Lord will welcome into His Kingdom?

Take your hollow words and your angry quotations of the Word, that discredit the message of peace and love so much, and reflect on them more. You are a scholar and seemingly a learned man, put this aside and approach Scripture with humility and show more graciousness and understanding.

Get thee behind me ....

23 December 2010 at 13:30  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman said 23 December 2010 13:30

'You really are a narrow minded and unloving man, with little compassion in your heart.'
Your attempt to produce feelings of guilt in me are a waste of time, I KNOW this tactic.
This tactic was developed to bring this feeling on 'Seperated Brethren' not on Catholics, even if I am an EX Catholic. We are forever the VICTIM in our own eyes are'nt we (RC Church) when confronted with TRUTH.
'Who gives you the right of deciding who is and who is not the'anti-christ'? '
John Lennon was heavily involved in lending his name, his time and his money on behalf of the civil rights of Catholics in Northern Ireland, he never embraced Catholicism himself despite regularly boasting of his Irish Catholic background. OR
'The press officer for the Beatles, Derek Taylor, said, "They're COMPLETELY ANTI-CHRIST. I mean, I am anti-Christ as well, but they're so anti-Christ they shock me which isn't an easy thing." (Saturday Evening Post, Aug. 8, 1964).
Paul McCartney said, "We probably seem to be anti-religious. . . none of us believes in God." (Hit Parader, Jan 1970, p.15)

John Lennon, in his book, A Spaniard in the Works, portrays Jesus Christ as, "Jesus El Pifico, a garlic-eating, stinking little yellow, greasy fascist bastard catholic spaniard." (A Spaniard in the Works, p.14).

Lennon also made that infamous statement, "Christianity will go, it will vanish and shrink. I needn't argue about that. I'm right and will be proved right. . . .We're more popular than Jesus now." (San Francisco Chronicle, April 13, 1966, p.26)

'To know who Our Saviour and Lord will welcome into His Kingdom?'

Revelation 21:27
'27 And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither [whatsoever] worketh abomination, or [maketh] a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.'
After the people sinned and made the golden calf, Moses interceded for them:
Exodus 32:31-33
'Exd 32:31 And Moses returned unto the LORD, and said, Oh, this people have sinned a great sin, and have made them gods of gold.
Exd 32:32 Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written.
Exd 32:33 And the LORD said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.'
Malachi 3:16-18
'Mal 3:16 Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard [it], and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name.
Mal 3:17 And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
Mal 3:18 Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not'

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 18:39  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman said 23 December 2010 13:30

Preacher and Len say similar things to myself except when I speak to Catholics I approach it differently as they were probably never catholic, wherea I WAS!

I know the problems catholics have in embracing The Lord Jesus Christ (RC Dogma) and as The Lord healed me of these same problems, I know what the answer is. IT IS THE WORD OF GOD, The Holy Bible which is the antidote/solution to all problems and conditions. This is WHY I quote scripture, as you well know, because it is completely opposed to our Dogma!

I know fully what WE believe, in a way Protestants can NEVER understand.

'Take your hollow words and your angry quotations of the Word, that discredit the message of peace and love so much, and reflect on them more.'
MORE WORDS TO TRY TO INDUCE GUILT..NOT WORKING, AS IT IS IMPORTANT YOU HEAR THE TRUTH.

State from passages within the Holy Bible where Catholic Dogma can be found and verified by the Words of God Father, Son or Holy Spirit, Prophets or Apostles. i.e

Infant Baptism, Sacerdotal Confessional, Worship of Statue's, Stations of The Cross, Praying directly to Saints, to Mary the Mother of Jesus, Indulgences, Pilgrimages,Transubstantiation (I UTTERLY HATE THIS BLASPHEMOUS WORD), PAPAL INFALLIBILITY, CELIBACY OF PRIESTHOOD, NUNS, WORSHIPPING SHRINES, PAPAL BULLS, ROSARY BEADS, MONOTONOUS REPETITION OF PRAYERS FOR FORGIVENESS OF SINS, SCAPULARS, SELF FLAGELLATION, Etc Etc..I am not even trying hard!
I am trying to make you think for YOUR SAKE!

So answer me, WITHOUT TRYING TO PUT ME THROUGH SOME EMOTIONAL GUILT TRIP THAT WILL NOT WORK..

'You are a scholar and seemingly a learned man,'( I AM NEITHER OF THESE EARTHLY TERMS, I AM JUST A CHRISTIAN WHO STUDIES HIS SCRIPTURE REGULARLY, ASKING FOR THE HOLY SPIRIT'S GUIDANCE AS JESUS PROMISED, TO KNOW WHAT I BELIEVE AND WHY!!)
'put this aside and approach Scripture with humility (a pretentious term used here as I ALWAYS DO, IT IS THE VERY WORD OF GOD) and show more graciousness and understanding.'
'SO YOU WOULD RATHER I LIE TO YOU, GRACIOUSLY BUT KNOWINGLY. WHAT SORT OF A PERSON WOULD THAT MAKE ME?

'Get thee behind me ....DO YOU EVEN KNOW IN THE SCRIPTURE WHERE THIS IS STATED WITHOUT LOOKING IT UP?

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 19:48  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

HIGHANDMIGHTY

You avoided my questions:

Who gives you the right of deciding who is and who is not the 'anti-christ'? Who gives you the right to determine who is saved and who is 'damned'?

Do you suppose in your pride and self rightousness to know the Mind of God? To know who Our Saviour and Lord will welcome into His Kingdom?

23 December 2010 at 21:09  
Anonymous len said...

"The unspiritual man does not receive the gifts of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual man judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. "For who has known the mind of the Lord so as to instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ. {1 Cor 2:14-16 RSV}

23 December 2010 at 22:14  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman 23 December 2010 21:09

You avoided my questions:HOW SO?

Who gives you the right of deciding who is and who is not the 'anti-christ'?

Do you need a fuller explanation of what I am referring to?

I DO NOT, GOD DECLARES IT!

1 John 2:18-19
"Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."

1 John 2:22-24
Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son. Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: but he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also. Let that therefore abide in you, which ye have heard from the beginning. If that which ye have heard from the beginning shall remain in you, ye also shall continue in the Son, and in the Father."

John plainly contrasts the Holy Spirit of God with "that spirit of antichrist," an attitude of opposing the reality of Christ, Who Christ is, What Christ is.

2 John 1:6-8
"And this is love, that we walk after His Commandments. This is the Commandment, that, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it. For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward."

'To know who Our Saviour and Lord will welcome into His Kingdom?'

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.”
John 5:24
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.”
Acts 3:19
"Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out..."

DECLARED BY GOD HIMSELF, READ HIS WORD AND BE BLESSED!
So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 22:59  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

KINGOFCARDSCR

Knowing and quoting scripture gives you no right to judge other people.

23 December 2010 at 23:23  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

'Knowing and quoting scripture gives you no right to judge other people.'

I judge no man, you judge yourself by what you say or what you do.

You declare yourself to be a loyal catholic, The Bible, therefore God Himself, declares He is opposed to false worship. Ist Commandment IN FULL , remember.
Roman Catholicism is a false Gospel,(Infant Baptism, Sacerdotal Confessional, Worship of Statue's, Stations of The Cross, Praying directly to Saints, to Mary the Mother of Jesus, Indulgences, Pilgrimages,Transubstantiation (I UTTERLY HATE THIS BLASPHEMOUS WORD), PAPAL INFALLIBILITY, CELIBACY OF PRIESTHOOD, NUNS, WORSHIPPING SHRINES, PAPAL BULLS, ROSARY BEADS, MONOTONOUS REPETITION OF PRAYERS FOR FORGIVENESS OF SINS, SCAPULARS, SELF FLAGELLATION, Etc Etc.) so by being in Roman Catholicism you are judged with IT. ANY CHANCE OF ANY ANSWERS TO MY LISTING OF DOGMA PRACTICES ABOVE???

Do you see, I do not judge you. God Does!

Revelation 18:4-5
'4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.

So Says KING OF HIGHCS

23 December 2010 at 23:45  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

KINGOFHIGHCS

You really want me to go through your list of mistaken views on Catholism one at a time? If I did no doubt you've a prepared list of responses with various scriptural quotes.

Suffice it to say a more informed understanding of the church's teachings and practices will come from reading the Catholic Cathecism. I'm sure one is available on-line. Read it!

I'm actually quite shocked by your lack of knowledge and understanding. If you had an accurate appreciation of the matters you refer to and we disagreed, then fine. Without this it seems pointless and unproductive.

24 December 2010 at 00:38  
Blogger KINGOFHIGHCS said...

Mr Eman 24 December 2010 00:38

As you obviously think that having the last comment is important to you so complete another after I have finished this one. OK

"You really want me to go through your list of mistaken views on Catholism one at a time?" OH YES PLEASE.......STOP TEASING ME!

"If I did no doubt you've a prepared list of responses with various scriptural quotes.' OBVIOUSLY, ROMAN DOGMA IS NOT BASED ON GOD'S WORD!

"Suffice it to say a more informed understanding of the church's teachings and practices will come from reading the Catholic Cathecism." DID I TELL YOU THIS, I WAS ONCE A CATHOLIC AND KNOW THE CATHECISM.

"I'm actually quite shocked by your lack of knowledge and understanding.(HOW SO) If you had an accurate appreciation of the matters you refer to (UNBIBLICAL DOGMA BASED ON TRADITION AND PAPAL BULLS) and we disagreed, (WE DO) then fine. Without this it seems pointless and unproductive.( Hmmn YOU REALLY WERE JUST TEASING ME, WEREN'T YOU"

So Says KINGOFHIGHCS

24 December 2010 at 01:00  
Blogger Chancellor More said...

KINGOFHIGHCC
Mr.Eman

Brothers,

Pray stop this unbecoming sparring. It discredits both you and the Faith you profess.

The issues raised have been the subject of endless disputation. My great friend in Christ, Desiderius,and I wrestled to understand and address many of the flaws of the Church in our time and the unquestioning adherance of its followers to some of the practices emanating from Rome.

Rather than the path of Luther, letting loose confusion and opening the door to the adversary, we chose the path of obediance, attempting dignified reform from within the Church.

Brothers, fundamentalism, be it Catholicism or Prostestant Evangelicalism, seperates and divides and comes from a spirit other than that of God.

In this season of goodwill hold your tongues lest you discourage those struggling in their faith.

The Peace of Our Saviour be with you both at this time of celebration.

Yours in Christ,

"God's Servant First"

24 December 2010 at 11:39  
Blogger Owl said...

Chancellor More,

Amen.

And a happy Christmas to all of you.

24 December 2010 at 13:47  
Anonymous len said...

Mr More ,
How can you reform Catholicism?

Catholicism is a religious system, a clever system. How to preserve error. How to perpetuate error. Make heresy infallible. And the arch heretic unassailable, ir-reformable and absolutely authoritative.

24 December 2010 at 16:23  
Blogger Mr Eman said...

Ien

Read the documents from Vatican II. These developments outraged more traditional Catholics.

Have a peaceful Christ-Mass and a good New Year.

24 December 2010 at 16:51  
Anonymous len said...

Mr Eman ,


My contention with Catholicism is as always with the System not the people.

God Bless you and all communicants.May those who do not know Jesus Christ have a revelation of Him during this season.

24 December 2010 at 19:33  
Blogger Chancellor More said...

Ien

Since Our Lord was with us in earthly form His Church has adapted and reformed as our human understaning of Truth unfolded.

Many theological and ecclesiastical developments have taken place.

At the time of the Protestant 'Reformation', not one reformation but many disputed reformations, the Church of Rome and clergy had fallen into many errors - not doctrinal but greed, lust, envy, all driven by the urges of the flesh. These need change and a greater adherence to Chuch Tradition and Theological understanding.

The Church of Christ is one and same thing as its people - one Body with many parts working together for the Glory of God.

Jesus the Christ chose Judas. Why should His Church not suffer the onslaught of the Enemy?

26 December 2010 at 16:59  
Anonymous len said...

Chancellor More,
The Church needs Christ.
If that is your aim I an totally with you.
Christ chose Judas knowing that he would betray him.Judas was the 'keeper of the purse'and he sold Jesus for 30 pieces of silver, so he valued wealth more than Christ perhaps the Church has a lesson to learn from this?

27 December 2010 at 13:45  
Blogger Alex said...

This was a really fantastic post that I really do appreciate. This is something that is really amazing and interesting to me to say the least.

29 December 2010 at 03:07  

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