Saturday, June 16, 2012

Gay Tory challenges 'intolerant' Church



Nicholas Le Quesne Herbert MP, Minister of State for Police and Criminal Justice, says: "I consider myself to be a Christian and I've never in my life felt more distant from the Church than I do at the moment."

Which is interesting, because His Grace considers himself to be a Conservative and he's never in his life felt more distant from the Party than he does at the moment.

And he's not alone.

196 Comments:

Blogger Roy said...

I wonder why the editor of the Times thought that the feelings of one politician few people have ever heard of are worth the headlines on the front page while the feelings of the well over half a million people who have signed the Coalition for Marriage's petition are worth ignoring?

Perhaps other media could contact the editor of the Times and ask him (or her - I don't know who the editor is) if he is deliberately using his position to push the Gay agenda.

16 June 2012 at 10:03  
Blogger Jessica Hoff said...

On your last point, I know at least four people active in the local Association, including the man who has acted as Agent in the last three general Elections who have refused to work for the Party again because of this. Dave won't be being invited to many 'country parties' in future.

16 June 2012 at 10:08  
Blogger len said...

The Conservative/Liberals are pushing forward agendas which are against the views of the vast majority of people in this Country'. Cameron seems to have little regard for 'conserving' the values which are the cement which holds our Society together?.

The' Gay agenda' for the overturning of Christian moral principles and values in our Society is the spearhead of this Government backed anti- Christian campaign.

"When the foundations are being destroyed, what can the righteous do?"(Psalm 11:3)

16 June 2012 at 10:10  
Blogger Naomi King said...

The spiritual weapons which can be wielded by every Christian, are not to be despised, for while not fleshy, they are mighty through God! God is in them! God is with those who use them! The Sword of the Spirit, which is the Word of God; the arrows of the Truths of God which pierce the consciences of men; the weapon of all-prayer; the influence of the Holy Spirit—that Divine Power—such weapons as these are, are mighty through God’s power, and are made mighty to the overthrow of spiritual principalities and powers!

16 June 2012 at 10:34  
Blogger Naomi King said...

And they served their idols (homosexuality): which were a snare unto them. Yea, they sacrificed their sons and their daughters unto devils, and shed innocent blood (abortion), even the blood of their sons and of their daughters whom they sacrificed unto the idols of Canaan (promiscuity) : and the land was polluted with blood. Thus were they defiled with their own works, and went a whoring with their own inventions (fornication and adultery). Therefore was the wrath of the LORD kindled against his people, insomuch that he abhorred his own inheritance. And he gave them into the hand of the heathen; and they that hated them ruled over them. Their enemies also oppressed them, and they were brought into subjection Again, they are minished and brought low through oppression, affliction, and sorrow. Let his days be few; and let another take his office (from David Cameron). Let this be the reward of mine adversaries from the LORD, and of them that speak evil. Let mine adversaries be clothed with shame, and let them cover themselves with their own confusion, as with a mantle. He poureth contempt upon princes, and causeth them to wander in the wilderness, where there is no way.
Through God we shall do valiantly (those that believe in His Holy Word): for he it is that shall tread down our enemies.

16 June 2012 at 10:35  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Roy said...
I wonder why the editor of the Times thought that the feelings of one politician few people have ever heard of are worth the headlines on the front page while the feelings of the well over half a million people who have signed the Coalition for Marriage's petition are worth ignoring?

The reason is Roy, that Danny Finkelstein, close friend of Mr Cameroon, is Editor of the Times and a chief advocate and policy former for homosexual "marriage" as is his friend Andy Cooper who is Director of of Policy at No 10.

This issue is now getting very personal.

16 June 2012 at 10:40  
Blogger Naomi King said...

len said...
Cameron seems to have little regard for 'conserving' the values which are the cement which holds our Society together?. The Conservative/Liberals are pushing forward agendas which are against the views of the vast majority of people in this Country

"they that hated them ruled over them" "Let his [David Cameron, Danny Finkelstein and Andy Cooper's] days be few; and let another take his office".

16 June 2012 at 10:48  
Blogger DanJ0 said...

"Nicholas Le Quesne Herbert"

Fabulous name!

16 June 2012 at 10:55  
Blogger Flossie said...

Snap, Your Grace. A lifelong Conservative, I shall not be voting for them again while Cameron is in office. His successor must firmly be on the conservative side of this issue before I am tempted back.

Cameron and his cohort are coming across as tyrannical bullies. 'We will listen to your concerns but we are not going to take any notice, and will go ahead regardless'.

I sent him, along with Theresa May and Lynne Featherstone, copies of my letter to my MP including graphic details of the state-sponsored Terrence Higgins Trust vile material, asking them if they thought it was suitable for children to see. None of them has responded, apart from David Cameron's office thanking me for my contribution.

History will not look kindly upon these people if gay marriage goes ahead. We will be holding them responsible for the fallout.

It's UKIP for me, from now on, and for many of my friends.

16 June 2012 at 10:57  
Blogger Corrigan1 said...

I can see why he'd be feeling distant: you don't expect principled moral stands for the Church of England.

16 June 2012 at 11:11  
Blogger Preacher said...

It's time that we started to read our Bibles & preach the gospel. In its entirety, instead of a milk & water inoffensive man pleasing version, with the intention of filling the empty seats.
We need to begin with the question: What is a Christian?. Or, rather what being a Christian is not.
1/ Being born to Christian parents does not make you a Christian.
2/ Being religious or going to Church, doesn't make you a Christian.
3/ Doing good works or being a nice person doesn't do it either.
4/ How about praying or singing in the choir? Nope.
5/ having a degree or a doctorate in Theology? Sorry!.

Step 1. Agree with God that you are a sinner (If we are honest with ourselves, this should not be that hard). repent of it, (Turn away from it & resolve to do your best with God's help to stay away from the things that have captivated you & mastered you in the past).
Accept that your freedom cost Jesus Christ, agony, suffering & death to redeem you. If the price was that high, the alternative for you must have been even worse.
Humble yourself before God, (tough one this eh?) & accept Gods pardon & make Him the Lord of your life.

When you do fail & fall (NOTE When, not if) bring the failure to God in repentance & be cleansed anew.
Read your Bible.

WELCOME TO THE FAMILY.

Blessings to all. Preacher.

16 June 2012 at 11:18  
Blogger bluedog said...

Your Grace, words cannot describe Cameron's ineptitude and stupidity.

Dave's support for SSM is a tipping point in British politics. In the process, Dave has shrunk the Conservative Party to an urban clique bounded by the M25. Outside this periphery the old values of the Conservative Party are represented by UKIP.

After the disaster of the Blair-Brown years, a large swathe of socially conservative Labour voters were until very recently prepared to consider switching allegiance to the Conservatives. Let's face, Ed Milliband isn't exactly a scion of the working class, apart from which his personal life is offensively progressive.

But the SSM debate and Cameron's enthusuastic support for gay marriahge has killed the opportunity to win over the old white working class, and the British equivalent of the Reagan Democrats are now in limbo. Your communicant believes this demographic was there for the taking at one point, but no longer.

One can already see Clegg positioning the Lib-Dims to break out of the Coalition unless massive and for the Conservatives, unacceptable, policy concessions are obtained. Next step will be a Lib-Lab coalition, which leaves the Conservatives high and dry.

UKIP would be crazy to associate themselves with Cameron, and Farage is hopefully too smart to succumb. UKIP's polling just gets better.

Vale the Conservative Party.

16 June 2012 at 11:23  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Corrigan1 said...
I can see why he'd be feeling distant: you don't expect principled moral stands for the Church of England. @11:11

Not so Corrigan the Church of England is showing clear and principled leadership and that is what all the fuss is about. They have hit a nerve and the homosexuals are frightened and acting irrationally.

Read "I'm a gay man who opposes gay marriage. Does that make ME a bigot, Mr Cameron?" from the DAIL MAIL
By ANDREW PIERCE himself a homosexual last Tuesday, 12th June 2012

"Tory rebels will be emboldened by this astonishing warning by the Church of England, which for once is showing clear and principled leadership, that it could be forced to abandon its traditional role of conducting weddings on behalf of the State.
Certainly, the Archbishop of Canterbury has dismissed as worthless the assurances of the Prime Minister and the Lib Dem Equalities Minister Lynne Featherstone — nicknamed ‘Featherlight’ by her despairing civil servants — that churches will not be ordered to conduct same-sex marriage ceremonies.

In spite of the furore caused by the Church of England’s intervention this week, Downing Street is insisting that Mr Cameron, who has so far performed 34 policy U-turns in power, has no intention of backing down on this issue.
Even gay rights campaigners are puzzled by the Prime Minister’s conversion to the cause.

taken from "I'm a gay man who opposes gay marriage. Does that make ME a bigot, Mr Cameron?" in the DAIL MAIL
By ANDREW PIERCE himself a homosexual last Tuesday, 12th June 2012

Read more on: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2158416/I-m-gay-man-opposes-gay-marriage-Does-make-ME-bigot--Mr-Cameron.html#ixzz1xwxnCq1J

16 June 2012 at 11:25  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

You have to be gay or gay encouraging to be a conservative these days ! What a laugh...

You’ll get this and it will continue to happen until local associations are once again trusted to appoint their own prospective parliamentary candidate. Don’t you worry, they’ll not let a ‘wrong un’ go up for them. Not that the Inspector is particularly bothered about it now. He’s finished with them. UKIP is the future...

16 June 2012 at 11:30  
Blogger graham wood said...

Flossie. (and Naomi) I agree fully with your post concerning Cameron and his homosexual friends in the Not The Conservative Party.

You are right - they ignore entirely all critical comment, and give the impression that they are contemptuous of it anyway. Power has bred arrogance in them.

With few exceptions MPs are insulated from opposing views (I have E mailed many Lib Dim and Tory MPs on the 'gay' marriage issue). Most of them, when they deign to answer have little intelligent to say, other than parroting the party line about "equal marriage".
Most don't seem capable of thinking for themselves and seem remarkably obtuse mentally.
All they are interested in is power, and rational discussion must not get in the way of their 'agenda'.

For some sound 'ammunition' against our naive and largely uninformed politicians, particularly May and Featherstone, do read and quote David Holloway's (vicar of Jesmond C of E) superb critique of the intellectually vacuous thinking of these people with their "My party right or wrong" mentality.
Whilst we rightly criticise our MPs for their degrading SSM policy, we also need to know, and be able to present to some of them who will listen, well argued, and biblically based, clear arguments to overturn their false values and prejudice for all things "gay". DH has done just that (I can give further details
off blog - grahamwood32@yahoo.co.uk

16 June 2012 at 11:50  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

A full researched enquiry should be mounted into the decline of the Conservative party. Not by the leadership, as they apparently are not interested, and besides, it’s all resources towards building a gay utopia right now. No, the inquiry should be mounted by UKIP.

You see, the best way to learn, to thrive, is to learn by your mistakes. There is though, a much better way; learn by other peoples mistakes. So UKIP, find out where the Conservative leadership lost it and do the exact opposite. Enshrine it into your constitution, and consider it sacred. Speak of what it was, what it is in hushed tones. Pass it down the generations that way. Lest the same problems ever visit you in the future.

16 June 2012 at 11:54  
Blogger uk Fred said...

Mr Herbert has forgotten one thing: the person whose view matters on whether he, Mr. Herbert is Christian or not Mr. Herbert, but someone who said "Whoever has my commands and obeys them, he is the one who loves me. He who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love him and show myself to him." Does Mr. Herbert have His commands and does Mr. Herbert obey these commands? He will not answer for this to any of us who comment on this blog, but to the One who is, always has been and forever will be.

16 June 2012 at 12:25  
Blogger Andrew Cadman said...

@bluedog, @InspectorGeneral

I have heard from some fellow 'Kippers that 'Old Labour Voters', are joining UKIP, and Owen Jones wrote an article in the Independent the other day alleging that working class Toryism is dying. With Cameron and co. in change, how can it not be?

I suppose together these groups pretty much encompass the White Working Class.

UKIP are fast becoming seen as the only alternative to everyone repelled by the Metropolitan Elite, which has so totally over our National Life. Only today, Patrick O'Flynn of the Daily Express anointed Nigel Farage as the true Leader of the Opposition.

Will his His Grade now swallow his pride, finally renounce his Toryism and join the One True Faith?

16 June 2012 at 13:08  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Andrew Cadman said...
@bluedog, @InspectorGeneral

I have heard that working class Toryism is dying. With Cameron and co. in change, how can it not be?

This is what David Cameron's PPS Desmond Swayne is reported to have said on Pink News three days ago, 13th June entitled "Possibility of gay religious weddings welcomed"

"Tory MP for New Forest West, and the Parliamentary Private Secretary to the David Cameron, Desmond Swayne voiced his support for religious marriage ceremonies [for homosexuals], having previously spoken up for equal marriage in his Out4Marriage video.

The Telegraph reports him saying today: “I’m a Conservative but I’m in favour of gay marriage because I am a Christian, I want to see my church being able to marry gay people.

“The world changes and this is a liberalising measure. This will enable people to do what they want to and what they believe is right. It doesn’t force anyone to do anything.

“Those who dislike the notion of gay marriage can continue to believe as they did before … this is a free vote matter, it’s a liberalising measure, it’s something on which people will hold different opinions and that’s what a consultation is for and that’s why we have a parliament.”

See the whole article

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2012/06/13/possibility-of-gay-religious-weddings-welcomed/

16 June 2012 at 13:23  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Somewhere, one day in the the future...

“Thank you for electing me this constituency’s Conservative MP. As you all know, I am gay and I thank you for placing your trust in me. You can be assured that when I am in Westminster, I will place the propagation of the the gay lifestyle first, but the interests of my constituents will always be a close second, and be especially dear to my heart. I would like you all to know this. Once again, thank you”

16 June 2012 at 13:36  
Blogger The Red Flag said...

There is a very simple way around this and that is to adopt something similar to the French.

Make church weddings purely ceremonial with no registrar in attendance. Legal weddings to take place at own halls.

That way Gays can get married and the Church can remain an anachronism.

16 June 2012 at 13:40  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

bluedog said...
"Your Grace, words cannot describe Cameron's ineptitude and stupidity."

I can think of a few. True, words cannot fully convey the depravity of this man's political and social dishonesty - "engineering" even. However, at times like this, access to a good thesaurus is helpful.

16 June 2012 at 13:41  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Andrew Cadman. “Kipper”. Delightful. Ich bein ein Kipper, mein herr !

Labour abandoned the White Working Class sometime in the early 1980s when they became a bit of an embarrassment to the college socialists. Many of their issues regarded immigration and the jumping of the housing queues, where they thought their children should have first pick. And, bless them, they were bloody well right.

You see, you can’t keep the working class happy and suck up to the immigrants at the same time. You have to fall over yourself to help one side at the expense of t’other....

16 June 2012 at 13:43  
Blogger Naomi King said...

And another one from Desmond Swayne, David Cameron's PPS.

“I’ve come at this issue of equal marriage,” he continues, “principally because I am a Christian. I believe that the promises of the Gospel are unconfined: they’re for everyone, and the sacraments that follow from that should be available to everyone. That’s why, I’m out4marriage.”

For the whole article see Pink News

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2012/05/23/video-pms-aide-desmond-swayne-comes-out4marriage/

With "Christian's" like this who needs heathen's ?

The Church in Burley, New Forest where Desmond Swayne lives I have been to many times. It is in an interregnum at present and Desmond does attend when he is at home. There is no point going to his surgery. It could be said that he is a disgrace to the faith and he cannot, in my opinion, be described as a Christian. His views certainly don't accord with the Church of England's declared position in her "A Response to the Government Equalities Office Consultation -“Equal Civil Marriage”- from the Church of England"

16 June 2012 at 13:47  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

Parliamentary Oath of Allegiance circa 2020:

"I, (Insert full name), do swear that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to the homosexual cause and all it's fabulous pomp and circumstance, according to equality legislation and my own secular and humanist values. So help me all the deviants, corruptors of decency and right living."

16 June 2012 at 13:47  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Mrs King. You be careful when you’re on that gay site. Always remember to wash your hands afterwards...

heh heh

16 June 2012 at 13:48  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Bless you Inspector I will be careful.

It is pleasing to note that Tim Montgomery writing in the Guardian on Friday is contemplating the removal of Mr Cameron.

Tim Montgomerie
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 12 April 2012 19.30 BS

"David Cameron may be error-strewn. But there's no alternative … yet

The Conservative leader is the subject of murmurings after successive strategic mistakes

Error has been piled upon error Cameron pursued the wrong kind of modernisation and we ended up as a party of white-collar liberalism rather than blue-collar conservatism. The Conservative party is a ruthless beast, and at other times there might have been serious speculation about the party needing a different leader with a superior strategy. Although leadership murmurings are indeed starting, they are far from serious. Despite the chaos inside the Downing Street operation, the vast majority of Conservative MPs still see Cameron as an asset. He's telegenic. Intelligent. Cool under fire. Magisterial in the House of Commons. It is, of course, far too early to make credible predictions about who may become Tory leader. Hopefully they'll have better strategic sense than the man they might succeed.
Cameron's greatest single advantage, however, is the absence of any obvious alternative to his leadership."

Tim Montgomerie
guardian.co.uk, Thursday 12 April 2012 19.30 BS

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/apr/12/david-cameron-no-alternative-yet

16 June 2012 at 14:35  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Tim Montgomery is, of course, the founder and lead writer for the ComservativeHome website.

16 June 2012 at 14:36  
Blogger Naomi King said...

And it gets better ...
Nadine Dorries MP writing on the ConservativeHome site this morning says

"Nadine Dorries MP: UKIP have a set of right wing policies which look "astoundingly Conservative"

Cameron and Osborne make one bad judgment call after another. Instead of speaking the language of the young and emulating their observations and intentions, they talk of defending the Eurozone, supporting the ECHR, spinning the same old tired Euro deal. The most embarrassing recent error has to have been Cameron’s Easter speech in which he called for all Christians to fight back for the right to wear a cross and chain at work, at the same time that his Ministers wrote to the ECHR to argue that Christians had no right to wear a cross and chain and to not support the cases before the court.

Do the government really think the electorate don’t notice this crass incoherence and incompetence? The electorate always seem willing to forgive Labour for such mistakes, as though messing up is somehow expected. They are far less forgiving of a Conservative government, as though they expect far better.

Is it any wonder Conservative MPs are wondering what to do? Where to go?

It would take only two MPs to cross the floor to give UKIP the publicity and coverage it needs to harness public disquiet and dissatisfaction with Cameron and the other main parties.

Two MPs to uplift UKIP to the centre stage.

Two MPs to turbo-charge a party into the credible political arena of the House of Commons.

Two MPs to transform the electoral opportunities of UKIP at the next general election by publicising and highlighting a silo for a protest vote which is not the Liberal Democrats.

And if it happens, if two MPs do cross the floor, if UKIP rob us of seats and destroy our chances in the marginals, if we lose to Labour at the next General Election because UKIP take a substantial share of the vote, there are just two men to thank for a repetitive string of bad decisions which led us there.

UKIP are the new Liberal Democrats but with truth, chutzpah, the wind in their sails and a set of right wing policies which look astoundingly Conservative.

As we appear to have a Prime Minister and a Chancellor who describe themselves as ‘social liberals’ rather than Conservatives, we should all be very worried indeed."

For the full text see

http://conservativehome.blogs.com/thecolumnists/2012/04/nadine-dorries-mp-cameron-and-osborne-are-not-doing-enough-to-discourage-britains-brighest-and-best-.html

16 June 2012 at 14:40  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Indeed Mrs King. There must be many Conservative MPs who are actively considering throwing their lot in with UKIP. One suspects that half a dozen or so would all go in that person’s wake. They would all be feted and go down in history of men and women of principal and commitment. Remember those two words from a time before everybody was out to see what they could get for themselves. They would become historical figures. Maybe even have a school named after them one day...

16 June 2012 at 15:08  
Blogger Naomi King said...

The current Tory leadership seems to be playing the electoral equivalent of Go for Broke, the board game where you race to lose a million pounds and the winner is the one who becomes penniless first. The tendency of Cameron to roll to the left in every decision he takes is not done just to please the Liberal Democrats, although there is far too much of that. Cameron describes himself as a "social liberal". The problem is that most of the sixty five million British voters aren’t. You would walk the streets of Essex or Yorkshire for a long time before you found a voter who described himself as a social liberal. The Liberal Democrats are an out and proud fully declared socially liberal party and only nine percent of the population voted for them, shouldn’t that tell us something? I will concede that the people in Cameron’s social circle may well be socially liberal. Social liberalism has always been an indulgence of the wealthy. The people who can afford to enjoy liberalism whilst protecting their own children from the societal effect of such by sending them to the most expensive schools. In addition to the majority of the British public being far from social liberals, they also aren’t stupid. They know that each family struggles financially whilst we send a billion of our hard earned cash to Europe each year and fiddles while Rome burns with gay marriage as a side show which many gay couples living outside of London or bohemian Brighton have no interest in. Which one gay couple clearly articulated as “we wish Cameron and others would just shut the **** up and leave us alone in our civil partnership”. Not all gay couples live in London and the south east.

16 June 2012 at 15:09  
Blogger Nicodemus said...

Naomi King - why don't you have your own blog? Just a thought.

16 June 2012 at 15:52  
Blogger Oswin said...

Nope, you're ''not alone'' Your Grace ... we are legion. Perhaps not quite the ideal choice of words, but hey...

16 June 2012 at 16:02  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

DanJ0 said...

"Nicholas Le Quesne Herbert"
Fabulous name!


Indeed - you spelt it wrong though. It should be:

Nicholas the Queens Herbert.

16 June 2012 at 16:03  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Or Nicholas the Queer Herbert ?

Interestingly the Oxford Dictionary defines queer as

"strange, odd, eccentric, of questionable character, shady, suspect, out of sorts,, giddy, faint,, drunk, homosexual, in difficulty, in debt or trouble, of disrepute, spoil, put out of order, spoil his chances beforehand.

So there we have it.

16 June 2012 at 16:56  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Nicodemus said...
Naomi King - why don't you have your own blog? Just a thought.

Nicodemus, you are so kind, and from one with such great Biblical credentials ! His Grace however moves in such elevated circles that I feel most honoured to be able to speak to his flock through the good offices of this his Holinesses blog.

May God bless him and all who consider vital the issues which are discussed here.

16 June 2012 at 17:02  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Interesting that the front page of today's Times, so helpfully reproduced here on His Grace's blog, has a lead article on "Why Women should read Mummy Porn" by Caitlin Moran.

My goodness what high moral principles the Times now aspires to !

16 June 2012 at 17:13  
Blogger Dreadnaught said...

Naomi King said:- The current Tory leadership seems to be playing the electoral equivalent of Go for Broke, the board game where you race to lose a million pounds and the winner is the one who becomes penniless first.

No she didn't. Never has as far as tell.

When she's not posting endless tracts from various holy writ she's plagiarising anything she can cut and paste and passing it of as her own. This last post of this pest is a compilation of at least three different sources.

Desist you fraud until you have an original thought of your own.

16 June 2012 at 17:14  
Blogger Flossie said...

David Cameron making one mistake after another ... well, I don't mind people making mistakes - we all make mistakes - but I find it very troubling that the country's Prime Minister doesn't appear to know right from wrong.

16 June 2012 at 17:21  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

Danj0: “"Nicholas Le Quesne Herbert" “Fabulous name!”
16 June 2012 10:55

Now who's googling around in someone’s life looking and hoping for the MP-in-his-underpants type revelation!

16 June 2012 at 17:25  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Sorry to tell you this Preacher but you are missing the point entirely about being a Christian.
Do read that Bible more closely.

There is no evidence of humility in any of your earlier points.
You confuse humility with self humiliation. You are wearing the hair shirt for no clear purpose.
Being judgemental and intolerant is also unchristian.Being an authentic Christian is leading a Christian life...and all that it entails (good works included)
Be ye doers of the word and not hearers only

YOUR FAMILY IS DISFUNCTIONAL AND CERTAINLY NOT CHRISTIAN

16 June 2012 at 17:49  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Cressie

Being a bit harsh on our friend the Preacher, are we not?

Its unlike you and I do hope you're not aquiring my bad habits. To think, it was you who threatened to kick me in the pants (or was it the parts?) and suggested I think of your legs when I was tempted to be be nasty.

Remember we must be kindly to all protestant Christians.

16 June 2012 at 18:02  
Blogger anna anglican said...

@Dodo, French Catholics have good form when it comes to protestants- remember the Huguenots and the St. Bartholomew's Day massacre?

16 June 2012 at 18:16  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna
Yes, and the Protestants weren't been very kind to Catholics in Ireland. The past is the past, young lady.

16 June 2012 at 18:30  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Dodo. You are right it is not in my nature to be nasty and I do not think your continual harrassment of len can be compared to my critical response to the Preacher.

However I found his arbitrary list of points based on some random thought process on what constitutes a Christian or not a Christian to be most offensive arrogant and unchristian.

16 June 2012 at 18:44  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Women eh, Preacher !

16 June 2012 at 18:50  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Anna Anglican...and in 1572 the Jews were being persecuted by the Christians of Europe...but being a Christian convert now...I don't suppose your Jewish heritage counts for much since you have joined the ranks of the oppressor.

16 June 2012 at 18:54  
Blogger Mr Integrity said...

Your Grace,
Many of your communicants are aghast at the Conservative behaviour and are considering voting UKIP.

My concern about UKIP is that we know very little about them and their policies and background.

I like what I see of Nigel Farage but of the others, who knows. Whilst they have taken a stance against redefinition of marriage, there is no guarantee that they will stay that way. Just as the Conservatives changed horses and got bridled with the liberal left.

The issue is what moral basis forms the policy of any party. UKIP, just as The conservatives, can change their policy at any time.

That is why I believe we need a party whose policies are based on a sound moral basis with Integrity and are foundational to the party. This would ensure the future being unchanging.

16 June 2012 at 18:57  
Blogger Mr Integrity said...

Naomi King said,
It is pleasing to note that Tim Montgomery writing in the Guardian on Friday is contemplating the removal of Mr Cameron.

I note on the web that Tim Montgomerie is in support of SSM.

16 June 2012 at 19:04  
Blogger Preacher said...

Cressida De Nova.
In your opinion! Which you are entitled to.
I read my Bible daily. May I enquire how often you do the same?.
You see your Idea of what a Christian is, is totally non scriptural. Any one can give an opinion, as Dr Cranmer's blog proves.
If you do read the word, I think you'll find 'repent' turns up quite a lot. Granted it's no longer popular.
IMO (which I am entitled to) If it was used more often from the front of the churches, a lot of things would become clearer & the sheep & the goats would be sorted out.
Judgemental & intolerant? No, I don't make the rules, I just warn of the consequences of breaking them.
Dodo.
Thank you for your sympathy, but I think I'm able to fend for myself by now.
Ever heard of the offence of the cross?, look it up brother. If the cross is not an offence & stings sinners, then we just aren't preaching the right message.
Thanks Cressida for your confirmation of the above.

Blessings Preacher.

16 June 2012 at 19:05  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Mr Integrity, there is no ‘considering’ about it. SSM was the final straw. What really vexes is the referendum on the EU that chancer promised us. Where the hell is it ?

16 June 2012 at 19:09  
Blogger Shacklefree said...

It’s nice to hear of Christians becoming less passive and more demanding. Maybe it takes the prospect of a modern day Sodom and Gomorrah to make Christians stand up and be counted. It is unfortunate that they did not do this in 1967 when the Abortion Act was legalized. If they had acted as Christians then we would have been spared this debacle. It seems to me that this is another sign of the End Times. The evidence is accumulating that we are in the generation spoken of by Jesus in Matthew 24:

32'Take the fig tree as a parable: as soon as its twigs grow supple and its leaves come out, you know that summer is near. 33 So with you when you see all these things: know that he is near, right at the gates. 34 In truth I tell you, before this generation has passed away, all these things will have taken place.

We have the signs; throughout the world Christians are the most persecuted of peoples, particularly under Communism and Islam; many have fallen away and are promoting vice instead of decency; we certainly have false prophets like Peter Tatchell and an increase in lawlessness; abortion above all proves that we have lost our love especially for the most defenseless and the Good News has been proclaimed to the whole World. This issue of homosexual marriage is just part of the overall picture not so much of being unable to follow God’s laws but of re-writing them. Now that we have financial disaster staring us in the face and Muslim aggression to destroy Israel more and more likely, especially with Obama’s support, it should not surprise us if we are approaching the time of great tribulation. We must of course fight against perversion to the end but let’s do it by spiritual means. It seems indicative of the present time that Church leaders en block are not getting together and insisting that the faithful of all denominations take part in a continuous prayer campaign to oppose this evil. Yet another sign of the times?

16 June 2012 at 19:11  
Blogger Flossie said...

I thought everybody knew that Tim Montgomerie is gay!

16 June 2012 at 19:23  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

You are right about' repent' and there is a lot of scriptural reference to your sort thinking they are without sin preaching to others. Your Sin obsessed preaching is a product of your disfunction not the scriptures. I do not know your religious denomination but according to my religion a compulsory study of the old and new testament and (singing Palestrina at eight years of age)
which according to the gospel of 'you' is not Christian) is required from a very early age.This is not to be confused with your community weekly Sunday School In my biblical interpretation you are endangering your immortal soul if you persist in the style of the pharisees. Your way alienates people from Christianity...and imo you are not man of God.Consider what Jesus was really like..you dont honestly think he was a bible bashing preacher do you. Reading your Bible daily does not make you a Christian. Pray for some guidance and listen!

16 June 2012 at 19:32  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

You are right about' repent' and there is a lot of scriptural reference to your sort thinking they are without sin preaching to others. Your Sin obsessed preaching is a product of your disfunction not the scriptures. I do not know your religious denomination but according to my religion a compulsory study of the old and new testament and (singing Palestrina at eight years of age)
which according to the gospel of 'you' is not Christian) is required from a very early age.This is not to be confused with your community weekly Sunday School In my biblical interpretation you are endangering your immortal soul if you persist in the style of the pharisees. Your way alienates people from Christianity...and imo you are not man of God.Consider what Jesus was really like..you dont honestly think he was a bible bashing preacher do you. Reading your Bible daily does not make you a Christian. Pray for some guidance and listen!

16 June 2012 at 19:32  
Blogger non mouse said...

Your Grace: as Oswin says, you are certainly not alone.

Well done, also, for show-casing the front page of The Times. What a shameful rag it has become... worse than the tabloids at the supermarket checkout.
______________________

Also:
Montgomery apparently said: Despite the chaos inside the Downing Street operation, the vast majority of Conservative MPs still see Cameron as an asset. He's telegenic. Intelligent. Cool under fire. Magisterial in the House of Commons. (qtd. by N King @ 14:35). So the vast majority of Conservative MPs are blind, deaf, and dumb in every sense. Why?

It is to be hoped rather more than 2 can discover the purpose of their vertebral columns.


Whatever is the matter with the British people that we countenance this rotten, diseased state of affairs? Nationalized Gangrene?

16 June 2012 at 19:45  
Blogger Phil Roberts said...

Cressida de Nova

Most people want to live their lives as they want and so do not want to believe in God.

Other Christians believe in a “God of Love” so that they can live their lives as they want

For both of them their God is an idol that is to please themselves not God

Sadly most Gay Christians seem to be in the last category. They believe in a “God of Love” so that they can live their lives to please themselves, not to please God.

Phil

16 June 2012 at 20:09  
Blogger Phil Roberts said...

Cressida de Nova

Maybe I misinterpreted you. Applogies if that is the case


Phil

16 June 2012 at 20:11  
Blogger Shacklefree said...

The problem with the British people is that they vote on economics instead of the gospel. We have reaped what we have sown and I'm not sure people realise that the affliction upon our nation is because we have turned our backs on God's laws.

16 June 2012 at 20:11  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Mr Integrity said...
Naomi King said,
It is pleasing to note that Tim Montgomery writing in the Guardian on Friday is contemplating the removal of Mr Cameron.

I note on the web that Tim Montgomerie is in support of SSM. @19:04

Flossie said...
I thought everybody knew that Tim Montgomerie is gay! @19:23

I do not know whether Tim Montgomery is homosexual or not although I do know he is unmarried. I do know however that he supports homosexual "marriage" and this no doubt explains why the ConservativeHome blog has a advert for "The Coalition for Equal Marriage" with that truly sickening video "the Homecoming" on it. (Maybe a job for the Advertising Standards Authority ? as it is doing the same job as His Grace's advert for the Coalition for Marriage, God bless C4M, was doing.)

By the most extraordinary coincidence Tim Montgomery's parents happen to live in my village, and a nicer, more Godly couple it would be difficult to find. His mother certainly was happy to sign the Coalition for Marriage Petition for Godly marriage in our Village Parish Church and I believe his father is of the same view.

Full credit should be given to Tim Montgomery for founding the Conservative Christian Fellowship of which David Burrows MP is chairman and as we know David Burrows is very actively involved in this campaign on behalf of Godly Marriage.

It is a great sadness to me, both for him and also for his parents sake, that Tim does not take the same view.

16 June 2012 at 20:58  
Blogger Anglican said...

Nicholas Le Quesne Herbert need not despair. In today's religious melt-down he should easily be able to find a church, or denomination, that will accommodate all his wishes.

16 June 2012 at 20:59  
Blogger bluedog said...

Well said, Cressida de Nova @ 19.32.

16 June 2012 at 21:05  
Blogger Naomi King said...

How true Phil

Phil Roberts said...

Most people want to live their lives as they want and so do not want to believe in God. Other Christians believe in a “God of Love” so that they can live their lives as they want. For both of them their God is an idol that is to please themselves not God. Sadly most Gay Christians seem to be in the last category. They believe in a “God of Love” so that they can live their lives to please themselves, not to please God.

Phil @20:09

This is EXACTLY what Desmond Swayne MP (the PM's PPS see me @13.23, to quote him

“I’m a Conservative but I’m in favour of gay marriage because I am a Christian, I want to see my church being able to marry gay people. The world changes and this is a liberalising measure. THIS WILL ENABLE PEOPLE TO DO WHAT THEY WANT TO AND WHAT THEY BELIEVE IS RIGHT. It doesn’t force anyone to do anything."

This isn't Gospel Christianity it's humanism dressed up to look like Christianity.

16 June 2012 at 21:08  
Blogger bluedog said...

That's encouraging news, Andrew Cadman @ 13.08. Under Cameron the social policies of Lib-Lab-Con are indivisible.

16 June 2012 at 21:14  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Phil Roberts:I cannot speak for Gay Christians.
I do not know any religious Gays.It would be interesting to hear their interpretations of the scriptures to justify their position.Unfortunately the only Gay Anglican on site spends her time prick teasing Catholic men so I do not think she would be a reliable informative source.

You have not made it clear what your interpretation of me is.So need to apologise.I have a personal relationship with God overlaid with some very strong conservative Catholic influences.
However I do not follow or agree with all Catholic doctrine.

I was raised to believe that the
Catholic church is the only true Christian Church and the tearaway brigade is the result of what you discuss in your post...people wanting to suit their own needs rather than the original scriptures.
That is why I resent a jumped up Preacher telling me what a Christian is because he reads the Bible everyday, when he is merely an imposter in my belief system without authority,belonging to a religion founded by a promiscuous serial killer Henry V111.

16 June 2012 at 21:15  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Oh come on Cessida ! The Orthodox were there LONG before the Roman Catholic Church was invented and they (the Orthodox that is) have some VERY strong things to say about the Roman Catholic Heresies which divided your church from the ORIGINAL catholic and apostolic church which is orthodoxy NOT Roman Catholicism. So please don't try and pull rank because you are in no stronger position than your Protestant brothers and sisters in Christ.

16 June 2012 at 21:29  
Blogger bluedog said...

Cressida de Nova @ 21.15 said regarding the Anglican Church, 'a religion founded by a promiscuous serial killer Henry V111.'

Wasn't the CofE established on ideas promoted by Anne Boleyn who had discoovered Protestantism in your native France?

16 June 2012 at 21:31  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Cressie, you are becoming very militant. I agree with you completely, of course, but you are inviting the "wrath of the weasel" on yourself.

In my experience, the Preacher is fairly moderate and considered in his protestantism and he is, I think, reacting to the anything goes theology within some of the the protestant cults and most notably Anglicanism.

16 June 2012 at 21:38  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

bluedog, she did learn one or two other things in France too.

16 June 2012 at 21:39  
Blogger Naomi King said...

My sympathies are with The Preacher. The war of the Gospel is against sin within the heart of man. When the Gospel endeavors to penetrate the human heart it meets with earthworks of prejudice which men have cast up to screen their minds from the force of the Truth of God. Many things are opposed to the knowledge of God. The objective sought is that men may be brought to know God—to know who He is and what He is. To know their relation to Him as fallen men. To know His plan of restoration. To know Him in Christ Jesus and to know as to love Him, to obey Him and to become like He. This is the great objective for which the Gospel is sent into the world—that the knowledge of the Glory of God may cover the earth as the waters cover the sea.
But men desire not the knowledge of God’s ways and shut up their hearts against the entrance of Divine Light by much evil reasoning and imaginations. Some are garrisoned against the knowledge of God by the feeling that they do not need to know God. The masses of our fellow countrymen are not so much opposed to the Gospel as indifferent to it.

16 June 2012 at 22:05  
Blogger len said...

Cressida you are in grave danger of opening a pandora`s box and revealing the serial killers who go by the names of Pope!.

16 June 2012 at 22:13  
Blogger bluedog said...

Naomi King @ 22.05, your faith is an inpiration to us all.

16 June 2012 at 22:14  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Let no one be in doubt that the protestant Church of England was founded at the point of a sword. In other words, obey Henry, and you get to live...

16 June 2012 at 22:15  
Blogger len said...

I am fully in agreement with the Preacher who presents Biblical truth in a very pleasant and reasoned fashion.

He is an example to all (myself included!.

16 June 2012 at 22:16  
Blogger len said...

Of course the Catholic inquisition was manned by a really nice bunch of Chaps..not!

16 June 2012 at 22:17  
Blogger len said...

Cressida you rebuked Dodo for being 'antagonistic' towards Protestants and now you are doing exactly the same thing!.

Having a bad day?

16 June 2012 at 22:19  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Naomi

What's this about Orthodoxy being there before Catholicism? New one on me. And, despite their differences, they have more in common than seperates them and certainly more than the various protestant sects share with one another.

Repentance is not all about sackcloth and ashes as sometimes represented. It is about turning one's life around based on the love of Christ and not driven exclusively by a fear of God.

'Metanoia' is a change of mind accompanied by regret and change of conduct, a change of consciousness. It is best represented in the New Testament by the parable of the Prodigal Son.

Christianity is joyous and hopeful; not gloomy and miserable. That, I think, was the point being made.

16 June 2012 at 22:19  
Blogger David B said...

@ Cressida

You probably do know some religious gays, but closeted ones.

David B

16 June 2012 at 22:20  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Cressie, I did warn you the "wrath of the weasel" would follow your support of Catholicism. True he took longer to reply than I expected but he can be slow at times.

16 June 2012 at 22:24  
Blogger Naomi King said...

By the power of the Holy Spirit the Gospel does carry flashes of conviction to shine upon the soul, it creates alarm, awakens apprehension and so storms the stronghold of indifference and utterly demolishes it! When the Holy Spirit convicts a man of sin, of righteousness and of judgment to come, he is indifferent no longer! Then the far most important question to them then is, “What must we do to be saved?” He enquires about the weightiest matters which concern eternity, God, Heaven, Hell and his own immortal destiny. But most of all, he wants to know, “How can I be at peace with God? Then the sinner discovers that if he does not know his God, it were better for him that he had never been born! He finds out that if he does not know his Saviour, he is doomed to endless woe and this makes him cry out in anguish of heart, for unbelief is the very act of high treason against the Divine Majesty.

16 June 2012 at 22:24  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Well you may have a good opinion of the preacher Dodo but please do not try to convert him. The last thing we need here is another Anglican convert.They make awful Catholics.

I know the 100 years war only seems like yesterday for a lot of you here but it is something you need to put behind you and move on with your lives. Along with the delusion that the Greek Orthodox Church is the original Christian religion and that ecumenical cosy fantasy that Catholic and Protestants are brothers and sisters..third cousins at best.

16 June 2012 at 22:31  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

The interesting thing about the weasel is that he also holds Anglicans in contempt. You see, they too have yet to be ‘born again’. One presumes that he does not play on this, at least for the moment, for strategic reasons. If after all, he did lay his cards out, there would be uproar, and the Archbishop himself would surely be as annoyed as the rest of us...

But one day, he won’t be able to help himself...

16 June 2012 at 22:36  
Blogger len said...

Cressida,
Catholics and Protestants are following different Gospels.Paul warns Christians about those who follow another Jesus, another Gospel, how can two walk together unless they are in agreement?.

Dodo, don`t you have a life apart from this blog?. I certainly have other things to do..sorry if you missed me?.

Anglican will of course make 'terrible Catholics' they have too much of the Truth to be be any different.

16 June 2012 at 22:37  
Blogger len said...

See the Inspector is still spitting venom and fantasizing about the 'gay issues'( I assume he is fantasizing)

16 June 2012 at 22:41  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

You parasitic fraud...

16 June 2012 at 22:42  
Blogger len said...

Inspector (of whatever) That`s probably the nicest thing you have ever said to me .

Not mellowing are we?.

16 June 2012 at 22:44  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

lp len

Here we go again, more poison from you about Catholicism. I will not respond in kind.

I do query wonder why you use the upper case in Protestant when, apart from your common antipathy towards Rome, you have little in common and really ought to use the lower case protestant.

As for 'Anglican', this really has very little meaning anymore as a title for a Church sharing a common set of doctrines.

16 June 2012 at 22:45  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

Weasel Attack!

Man the barricades and set the dogs loose.

16 June 2012 at 22:47  
Blogger len said...

I think you are a real case Dodo , lower probably?.

I think the Inspector is of the fruit and nut variety?.

16 June 2012 at 22:47  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

...and Jesus came upon Len and said to his disciples, “giveth to me the baseball bat”...

16 June 2012 at 22:53  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Naomi

You domake it all sound so dreary and fire and brimestone.

I started my journey as a Christian not through fear or an awareness of my own sinfulness and wrath to come. No, what impressed me as a child and then as a man was the sheer love of Christ. The rest just kind of falls into place as a member of the Catholic Church where we are taught who God is and what God expects from us.

16 June 2012 at 22:53  
Blogger Preacher said...

Thank you Naomi, I could not have presented the case for the gospel better.

Dodo thank you too for your Kind words.
I find many things in ALL the denominations that grieve my spirit, I hope that any criticism I give will be constructive, as this is my desire.
It is so easy to fight one another & while we are engaged in that to ignore our main enemy & allow the souls of many to be forfeited for eternity.
It's so easy for all of us to rip & tear each other to shreds, winning arguments but creating heat but no light.
Fear is one of the devils most potent weapons, producing hate evil & bitterness between the sons & daughters of mankind. But God's perfect love is the answer to fear.
This is my Credo.

Blessings. Preacher.

16 June 2012 at 22:58  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Among the other, “imaginations,” with which man fortifies himself is the idea of many that they know already. Trained from their childhood in false doctrine, they hold fast to it and defy the Gospel to reach them. They are Christians by birth, they say, forgetting the Inspired Declaration, “that which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.” Others make up their minds as to what the knowledge of God ought to be and, of course, they quarrel with God’s view of things. They fashion a god and a gospel after their own fond notions and then they dream that they have reached the summit of wisdom! They refuse to go to school to learn Christ and when He says, “Except you are converted and become as little children, you shall in no wise enter into the kingdom of God,” they turn from Him with disdain! They know quite enough and are resolved to learn no more.

A large proportion of our fellow men are in this condition and are perfectly content and satisfied to remain as they are. Graduates in the university of self-importance—full of ignorance and equally full of pride—Nothing shuts the heart more completely against the knowledge of God than the conceit that we already know and need no teaching from above! The things which are of God, they are spiritual and must be spiritually discerned! A little heavenly Light suffices to reveal to men their darkness, for if they will but think, they must admit that if God deigns to teach us in the Scriptures, it must be because apart from them we are ignorant! There is no need of Revelation and the Bible is worthless; there is no need of an Incarnate Deity and Calvary is a superfluity if men already know God apart from the Lord Jesus and the Word by which He is pleased to reveal Himself! But let the Holy Spirit bring this home to a man’s heart and he begins to cry out against his own pride! He bemoans his own blindness and he is quite willing to become a fool that he may be wise, a child that he may sit at Jesus’ feet! The old Scripture is not out of date which says,” Incline your ear, and come unto Me: hear, and your soul shall live.”

16 June 2012 at 22:59  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Absolutely Dodo...

"What impressed me as a child and then as a man was the sheer love of Christ."

I can say exactly the same is true for me as well, both in childhood and womanhood.

16 June 2012 at 23:04  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

little pope len

Just as I'd thought we'd found some common ground you revert to your spitefu;l little ways.

Let me remind you of your recent comments on an earlier thread:

Dodo John 13:35 >
'By this all men will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another'.

Matthew 7:16-20

16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.

18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.


Please try to contain your hatred for all things 'religious' and Catholic.

16 June 2012 at 23:08  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Cressida said...

and that ecumenical cosy fantasy that Catholic and Protestants are brothers and sisters..third cousins at best.

How sad...

16 June 2012 at 23:10  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

The reason people are indifferent to Christianity is because of people like you Naomi. Do you converse like your posts in real life. It is scary with all that spittle flecked rant and rave.
You make Christianity the biggest turn off of all time.I bet the Greeks hid under their donkeys if you carried on in that way over there.Probably put a few shots of ouzo in your coffee to calm you down. All this obsession with sin ...what on earth are you doing that is so terrible apart from boring us to death?

16 June 2012 at 23:13  
Blogger Atlas Shrugged said...

Len, I would go further.

Roman Catholicism is perfectly antithetical to true Christianity.

Although not to The Anglican Church, or necessarily to Protestantism in general, which is largely only distinguishable from The Roman Empires Church for political reasons.

Jesus made his opinions perfectly clear with respect to institutions as rich, powerful and widely extended at that of The RCC.

I think it could be said that he was less then enthusiastic, to say the least.

Anti-semitism is an issue close to my heart, it having accounted for a sizable proportion of my mothers family. All of which lost their struggle for existence in a largely Roman Catholic country, namely Poland.

I was left in little doubt as a child that anti-semitism was almost exclusively a long standing policy of The RCC, which goes back many thousands of years, but most especially at the time of the crucifixion.

As we know it is The Roman Empires Church which put it about that Jesus was killed by Jews. Which is rather strange because our bibles as well as our history books and common sense dictates that Jesus was killed by Romans.

I am sure you know exactly where I am going with this, therefore to save Dildo, and our Inspector having collective heart attacks, I will leave it there for now.

16 June 2012 at 23:16  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Naomi

What cressida said is terribly sad - but true.

Just read what your fellow protestants say about Catholicism. Then consider the part some of the protestant churches are playing in permitting and condoning the very sins you rightly condemn.

16 June 2012 at 23:23  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Atlas

This tendency to call me Dildo is revealing. You must purge all lustful thoughts about me from your mind. For goodness sake man, I know you have a sexual obsession with Catholics but I thought it was limited to young females.

16 June 2012 at 23:26  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:26  
Blogger anna anglican said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:29  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

And Atlas you disrespect your mother's ancestry by misrepresenting anti-semitism in Poland. Have you any idea of Luther's views on the Jews and how these influenced the German mind?

16 June 2012 at 23:29  
Blogger David B said...

@ Len, who said

"I was left in little doubt as a child that anti-semitism was almost exclusively a long standing policy of The RCC, which goes back many thousands of years, but most especially at the time of the crucifixion."

Many thousands of years?

But let that pass - have you read what Luther said about Jews?

But then, you might argue that Luther was a Catholic. Where is a 'shrugs' smiley when you need one.

David B

16 June 2012 at 23:30  
Blogger anna anglican said...

@Dodo,

You agree with Credessia against Naomi, but in all fairness her posts are only ever to do with gays and gay marriage. Something which you agree with her on. Perhaps, now that 'ranting and raving' is directed against Catholics and not gays, you understand a little bit of what it is like to be bullied for being what you are and for what you follow?

16 June 2012 at 23:34  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:34  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

I do take your point about homosexuality and Naomi. However, to my knowledge, as a Christian, you have never defended active lesbian or homosexual acts and have stated more than once you are celibate.

16 June 2012 at 23:37  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:42  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

I say, the ladies are being lively tonight!

16 June 2012 at 23:44  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Oh dear, oh dear...

Time for bed.

16 June 2012 at 23:44  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Dodo,

The reason is quite simple. I just don't believe that Catholic Church and its dogmas. I like the Anglican Church and its ability to question faith, in which all views are listened to, for example Preacher says some good things, so does Carl Jacobs, Danjo- I like to read a diverse set of views before I reach my own conclusions. Too much of a free spirit you see. I also told you why I am not a Catholic many, many posts ago and you said it was boring or something like that (which is typical you, like insulting your opponents in the hope that they'll reply in like kind- like you do with Danjo).

Also I have concluded there is zero point in debating with you or your side kicks, Inspector and Credessia- see Carl Jacobs points to you earlier on in the week for the reasons there.

16 June 2012 at 23:45  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:45  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

So there we have it Shrugged. Your crusade against the RCC is based on your family loses of the second world war. You can’t blame the NAZIs today, they’ve been defeated, so you dig wide and deep for libel to post against the Catholics. Helps keep your hatred alive does it. But it does explain your particular posting activity ever since the Inspector arrived here. You need help of the professional sort. You need to be free of your hatred. You're on the edge now, and to be frank, the picture is not looking good...

16 June 2012 at 23:47  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

You don't believe Catholic's question their faith? Of course we do! You'd be surprised at the diversity of opinion permitted. However,there are some 'bottom lines' in Catholic theology and some very clear proscribed actions that flow from these.

Too much free thinking, mixed with liberalism, without authority and you get the mess Anglicanism has become.

16 June 2012 at 23:50  
Blogger anna anglican said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

16 June 2012 at 23:50  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Oh I did not realise that Ania was a celibate Anglican homosexual who does not defend lesbianism or ssm.Kikes and Tykes are used to being persecuted but Ania does not seem to involve herself in anything too demanding or defining .Perfect for Anglicanism and very disappointingly unkosher.

16 June 2012 at 23:59  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Dodo,

Well, I hope the blog Admin person is going to delete Credessia's post at 21.15 i which the certain phrase was used (which has meant those posts have been deleted?).

17 June 2012 at 00:00  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Credessia

I think you owe me an aplogy for how you described me earlier. Oh and what I get up to in my relationships is nothing to do with you. (or dodo).

17 June 2012 at 00:02  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Cressida, rather think Anna may not be entirely gay after all, but despairs of male youth, as indeed the the Inspector does. Just not bright or mature enough to interest her. Over to you girl...

17 June 2012 at 00:04  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Atlas you have conveniently forgotten those Catholics (true Christians) who put their own lives at risk hiding Jews in Poland and other parts of Europe.Many of us lost family members who were caught. Thankfully some are still grateful.

17 June 2012 at 00:17  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Cressida, Shrugged’s credibility on this site, in the doubtful case that he had any left, is finished. The Inspector will see to that, don’t you worry...

17 June 2012 at 00:29  
Blogger Atlas Shrugged said...

Not at all.

I speak of The Roman Catholic Church, not of its members.

Good is personified by the lives and actions of ordinary people, not of the corporatist institutions that so often bleed them dry.

With the notable exception of one or two ordinary members of The Church of Rome, whose avatars I care not to mention, Roman Catholics are no less wonderful then any other group in common society.

It is possibly true to say that even among the various murderous psychopaths that rule our more established institutions, at least some would not rape their pets, sell their own mothers at an overly low price, or steal the last dime from their own children.

Please understand that my moderately extended family is not only Jewish, Hindu and Anglican, but also contains a sizable amount of practicing Roman Catholics.

17 June 2012 at 00:40  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

Apologies, you are correct. cressida did call you a "prick teaser" earlier this evening. My mistake. She is very perceptive.

And I have no interest at all in what you "get up to" in your relationships. It was you who claimed to be celibate because of your Christianity.

17 June 2012 at 00:44  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Atlas

Yes, and some of my best freinds are ..........

Do one!

17 June 2012 at 00:46  
Blogger Oswin said...

A lot of nasty stuff above. Some of you ought to be ashamed; what's the betting that won't happen?

17 June 2012 at 01:34  
Blogger Preacher said...

Oswin.
Totally, I agree. That's why I stepped out of the - Discussion?.
When you jog a brimming cup, what's inside spills out.

Blessings. Preacher.

17 June 2012 at 07:59  
Blogger IanCad said...

I'm with Oswin on this.
Let's try to conduct these debates with a little more dignity.

17 June 2012 at 08:07  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Shrugged...

My deep sympathies go out to you and your family, the lack of love shown by parts of the Church to God's Chosen People is a shame upon all of us who profess to be Christian. We have much to be repentant of and for my small part I apologise and repent to you and your Nation for all those events and actions where the British Nation has failed to protect, preserve and honour the Jewish Nation as she was called by God to do. God bless you all.

God grant that proud thinkers may become Believers. Where the Gospel comes, it undermines and overturns everything which opposes the Truth of God. Man, having devised the fortress of reasoning, erects towers of pride on them which the Apostle St Paul calls, “high things,” of which he says that the power of God casts down “every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God.” These lofty castles are such as the following—“I have a noble nature within me. My instincts are towards right. I have not done much amiss. I am as good as my neighbour. I can overcome any temptation. I am persuaded that I can fight my own way into eternal happiness,” and all such vain ideas.

An entrenchment, behind which many are securely hiding, is the idea that if they do not know God they can find Him out without His help. This is a very general notion, nowadays. Scientific thought is supposed to be the way for finding out God and the old Scripture is out of date which says,” Incline your ear, and come unto Me: hear, and your soul shall live.” Plain truth is of small account—men crave to be mystified by their own cogitations. Many glory in being too intellectual to receive anything as absolute certainty—they are not at all inclined to submit to the authority of a positive Revelation! God’s Word is not accepted by them as final, but they judge it and believe what they like of it.

This is madness! The Lord knows what is better than we can ever know and if He has been pleased to speak plainly and solemnly His Word, it is ours to believe what He says because He says it! It may be all very well to prove that such-and-such is consistent with reason, consistent with analogy, consistent with a thousand things—but the attitude which needs such argument is a spirit of rebellion against God! If there is a Revelation, every part of it is of authority and must be believed. Human thought is not the arbiter of Truth, but the Infallible Word of God is the end of all strife. As St Paul said for the “Casting down of imaginations, and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ.”2 Corinthians 10:5.

“Surely,” it can be said, “we ought to modify our beliefs by public opinion and the current of thought.” “NO,”! The Incorruptible Word of God lives and abides forever and It is not ours to say what the Truth of God must be, or what we think it should be, or what we would like it to be— but reverently to sit down with open ears and willing heart to receive what God has spoken. It is incapable of modification! To modify is to adulterate, nullify and render it of no effect, so that it becomes another gospel and, indeed, no Gospel.The thought of tampering with the revealed Truth of God is vicious and ought not to be tolerated by any Christian for a second!

The Gospel of Jesus Christ is not a thing which is to be molded according to the fashion of the period—it is “Jesus Christ the same yesterday, today, and forever.” No man was ever led to a saving faith by our meeting him half way and consenting to his unbelief! No real faith was ever worked in man by his own thoughts and imaginations—he must receive the Gospel as a Revelation from God.

Faith and love is a supernatural work wherever it is found.

17 June 2012 at 10:03  
Blogger len said...

David B,

Luther(You can take a man out of religion but it is a totally different matter getting religion out of the man, as you have suggested) said some pretty terrible things about the Jews and I think this was taken on board by 'established Religion also the Nazi administration(if you can call it that) 'Replacement theology is one of the causes of anti- Semitism.

Justin Martyr - 100-165AD Claimed God's covenant with Israel was no longer valid, and that gentiles had replaced them.

Ignatus said that those who partook Passover were partakers with those who killed Jesus.

Tertullian - 160-220AD Blamed the Jews for the death of Jesus.

Origen 263-339AD Origen and his school in Alexandria taught the interpretation of nearly all scripture as 'allegorical' rather than literal and based teaching on Greek philosophy. Although he was considered heretical at the time he was tolerated and influenced the church teaching profoundly. He was responsible for much Anti-Semitism and accused Jews of plotting to kill Christians.
Eusebius 263-339AD Wrote an influential history of the church and taught that the promises of scripture were for the gentiles while the curses were for the Jews, and that the church was the "true Israel"

John Chrysostom 344-407AD Was the greatest preacher of the day but preached that there could never be forgiveness for the Jews, it was the Christian's duty to hate Jews and that the Jews worshipped the Devil.

Jerome Produced the Latin translation of the bible which became the official bible. He said , "Jews are incapable of understanding scripture and should be severely punished until they confess the true faith." The authors of the scriptures believed that the Jewish Messiah would literally establish a kingdom on earth which would bless the gentiles too, but this was rejected in favour of a non literal "replacement theology"

Augustine 354-430AD Turned the literal into spiritual - "The kingdom is only spiritual, is now, and is in men’s hearts. The millennium is now and Satan is bound". He wrote that the Jews deserved death but were destined to wander the earth to witness the victory of church over synagogue. The Catholic church has recently refuted this view but it is still around.

17 June 2012 at 10:17  
Blogger len said...

Continued The Church becomes "Establishment" and Gentile

Constantine

In 312 CE The Roman Emperor Constantine accepted the Christian faith, or at least his version of the Christian faith. Whilst preparing for another military campaign he claimed to have had a vision of the cross against the sun, accompanied by the words, "In this sign, conquer." As Constantine made Christianity the state religion it started to be corrupted by man centred thinking and Greek philosophy. Constantine was present at the Council of Nicea (below) and his influence sanctioned the moves away from the roots of Christianity.

In David Stern's JNTC (p274), he quotes an informative contemporay writing from Epiphanius -

Why, in the past, did many Jewish believers. in practice, leave their people? Because in the fourth century, when Roman Emperor Constantine converted to Christianity and the Gentile-dominated Church gained political power, it began to require Jews who accepted Yeshua as the Messiah to give up all ties with Judaism, Jewish practices, Jewish friends and anything Jewish.

David Stern continues,
During most of the last 1,500 years a Jewish believer Yeshua had to take on Gentile religious and cultural ways, first, because the Jetwish community excluded him, and second, because of Christendom's social pressure and distaste for Jewish ways. Concerning the latter, it is as if "men from Rome came down began teaching the Jewish brothers, `Unless you totally ignore your circumcision, in the manner prescribed by Moshe, you cannot be saved!"
'Much of the Church continues to insist on this view, unscriptural though it is, basing their opinion isolated passages misinterpreted, particularly Ep 2:11-15, 1 C 10:31 and Ga 3:28: notes to these passages and the rest of Acts for further discussion.
The correct conclusion is: a Jew who becomes Messianic remains a Jew, and a Gentile who become a Christian remains a Gentile) www.wildolive.co.uk

(It will be interesting when the 'Christian' anti Semites meet the Jewish Jesus who is and always will be the Lion of Judah.)

God has by no means finished with Israel
Romans 11:25–26
25 For I do not want you, brethren, to be uninformed of this mystery—so that you will not be wise in your own estimation—that a partial hardening has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in; 26 and so all Israel will be saved; just as it ...

17 June 2012 at 10:17  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

@Oswin, Preacher, Ian

Which people in particular should be ashamed of themselves?

17 June 2012 at 10:33  
Blogger Chris said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

17 June 2012 at 10:36  
Blogger Chris said...

A further note.

I am not judging Nick.

But what does it mean to be a Christian?

Read Romans 14 - The Weak and the Strong

"You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat."

What was that again? what does it mean to be a Christian?

17 June 2012 at 10:57  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Naomi how about apologising to the homosexuals for your homophobic rants which have been going on for weeks.And you are correct,you do bring shame upon us all who profess to be Christian.I wish you would call yourself something else.
Your hypocrisy is breathtaking.

17 June 2012 at 11:39  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Cressida. The stance taken by Mrs King is quite understandable considering the barrage of gayness that has assaulted society. One should remember that none of us is required to ACCEPT homosexuality, merely to tolerate it. As any engineer will tell you, if any one factor moves outside of tolerance limits, you get problems. I put it to you now, that is exactly what campaigning gays have done. Torn up the unwritten settlement we had in place.

17 June 2012 at 12:16  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

The 3 people who are tireless in posting against gays are ;

1. Naomi King
2. Dodo
3. Inspector

2 Catholics and 1 Protestant.

17 June 2012 at 12:40  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

To echo Edith Piaf – “I regret nothing”

17 June 2012 at 12:44  
Blogger bluedog said...

Captain Draconis, without wishing to put words into the mouths of communicants 1,2 & 3 above, one can understand their frustration.

An Earthly demographic that represents just 1.5% of the population in any known census has decided to insult the other 98.5% of the population until it (the 1.5%) gets what it wants.

As His Grace has pointed out, at one stage we had traditional freedoms and you could do pretty much what you wanted if it wasn’t expressly forbidden. Then somebody invented human rights and our freedoms were codified. Being codified these rights also became legally enforcible, or coercive if you wish. Inevitably there comes a time when the codification of rights leads to a conflict of rights. Once there is a conflict of rights there is an equally inevitable resolution of conflict by creating a hierarchy of rights. That is the point we have reached now with the claim that the right to a gender neutral form of marriage (equality) takes precedence over the current form of marriage which is gender specific (diversity).

Considering that marriage is seen as a foundational sociological structure here on Earth, the various Earthlings who protest its corruption have a point.

How are your progeny looking in the incubator banks? Any change in colour? Are you still not on speaking terms with the intern whose eggs you confiscated?

17 June 2012 at 13:10  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

If there are any still out there wavering over SSM, remember this. Your child or grandchild WILL be taught the intricacies of gay sex. Every last disgusting detail. They WILL be taught it’s ‘normal’. And you won’t have a say in the matter because Stonewall and Terence Higgins will go to the ECHR and they will MAKE the school teach it them. And if you oppose them, you will be guilty of contempt of that contemptuous court.

And that isn’t going to be for this year or next year, but for all time. Until or unless this country has the sense to cut away from that evil institution...

Vote UKIP !

17 June 2012 at 13:23  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Let's not forget the "social engineer" who plays forum chess with us and provokes this harsh reaction in elderly women and Catholics. Read back through his posts and witness his crude and offensive posts.

17 June 2012 at 13:45  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Dodo,

And who is this man? I can't find anymore with the monkier "social engineer"?

17 June 2012 at 14:12  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Anna. He bats for the other side...

17 June 2012 at 14:16  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Christianity In A Nutshell

When asked what was the greatest commandment
"Jesus said unto him,Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul,and with all thy mind.This is the first and great commandment And the second is like unto it,Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
(Matthew 22:37-40)

17 June 2012 at 15:11  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

The internet social engineer to whom I referred is well known for targeting the more mature woman and Catholic males in particular and for giving explicit descriptions of homosexual activities.

During the course of discussions he is skilled at extracting personal information which he then stores and uses tactically to provoke ill-judged responses. He plays on what he perceives to be their personal weaknesses.

Recently he openly bragged about using the deceptive and manipulative tactics of cyber "social engineering". Of course he claims he does so "ethically" and always for the good of the victim.

Just so you know:

"Social engineering ... is ... the art of manipulating people into performing actions or divulging confidential information. While it is similar to a confidence trick or simple fraud, it is typically trickery or deception for the purpose of information gathering, fraud, or computer system access.

"Social engineering" as an act of psychological manipulation had previously been associated with the social sciences, but its usage has caught on among computer professionals."
(Wiki)

Still want to know who or have you guessed?

17 June 2012 at 16:19  
Blogger DanJ0 said...

Blimey, it looks like hell hath no fury like a sneaky fraud, hypocrite, and liar exposed. Lol.

17 June 2012 at 16:31  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

17 June 2012 at 16:47  
Blogger IanCad said...

Cressida de Nova @ 15:11

In no way am I implying that this pertains to your understanding of the beautiful verses you quoted above; But, quite often, these passages are used to abrogate the Ten Commandments. Even taken by some as license to exercise their own judgement as to what is, or what is not, the will of God.
In truth, they emphasise the currency of the Decalogue. Love of God relating the First Table of the Law and love to neighbor the second.

17 June 2012 at 16:57  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

DanJ0

Shucks that's not very nice is it?

Please promise not to tell people (again and again and again) about my using false ID's last August. You know how it upsets me.

LOL!

17 June 2012 at 17:01  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

@Anna,

My space- time senses could be wrong here, but I think Dodo refers to your fellow gay compatriot Danjo?

17 June 2012 at 17:54  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

IanCad said ...

" ... quite often, these passages are used to abrogate the Ten Commandments. Even taken by some as license to exercise their own judgement as to what is, or what is not, the will of God."

Indeed, and most frequently by liberally minded protestants who abandoned the authority of the Apostolic Church in favour of individual "inspiration". What do you expect?

17 June 2012 at 17:56  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

@Blue Dog,

I haven't been called 'Captain' in many years- I sometimes think I should buy a commission with the Nighbright Alliance and go out in glory!

It is interesting that you quote 1.5% -I always thought your democracy was about the will of the majority -not the minority? If so why do the gays-from a certain viewpoint- hold so much sway? What you write almost sounds like a caste or elite system with those percentages?

17 June 2012 at 17:57  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

I had also thought (for a brief moment)that Dodo was referring to Carl Jacobs- he is an engineer,no? But then I reasoned that Carl is more or less on the same side viz gay marriage, so I thought not even dodo is dodo enough to insult his own side!

Also, did I read correctly that Danjo is also an engineer? Does he(or even Carl) do Fusion reactors? Mine is like an old boiler, but I didn't get in, when the emperor undertook fiscal stimulus last decade and did a 'cash for Reactors' deal. I could have had a nice combi- fusion reactor by now!

17 June 2012 at 18:02  
Blogger gentlemind said...

I almost feel sorry for Nick Herbert and other passionate supporters of the proposed abolition of marriage. If your worldview tells you that two people of the same sex can marry, then your worldview also tells you that resistance to them marrying must be based on homophobia. I would very much like the Coaltion For Marriage to start asking the opposition what it is they think marriage is. If marriage is not based on the principle of procreation, then what is it based on?: 1. Why is marriage a sexual relationship? 2. Why is it a sexual relationship between two people? 3. What is it about the relationship that makes it worthy of state reward? There is no attempt to define what marriage is. One side of the argument is very happy with that, because they cannot answer the three questions above.

17 June 2012 at 18:02  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

PS- to Blue dog, I cite a caste system because you humans often berate us Draconis for having a very rigid caste system (our society is divided- warrior, religious and worker)implying your free market approach is better.

17 June 2012 at 18:06  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Alpha

Is this Japanese song popular in the future?

Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl
Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl
Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy- Girl
Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl

danjo danjo
danjo
boom boom
thud crash

Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl
Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl
Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl-Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy- Girl
Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy-Girl-Boy-Boy-Girl

danjo danjo
danjo
boom boom
thud crash

17 June 2012 at 18:09  
Blogger anna anglican said...

I bet more likely that "Mambo Italiano" is still a classic in the future. I personally like the shaft version from the naughties.

17 June 2012 at 18:27  
Blogger IanCad said...

Dodo @ 17:56,

The Church of Rome nullified both the Second and Fourth Commandments long before Protestantism was a force.
To claim that Roman Catholicism is the Apostolic Church is a complete fiction.
No church could be more unlike the simple, early church than that which rules from the See of Peter.

17 June 2012 at 18:28  
Blogger anna anglican said...

@Ian Cad-

Tell that to Credessia De Nova- who said above the 'true' Christians were Roman Catholics only.

17 June 2012 at 18:31  
Blogger DanJ0 said...

Alpha: "It is interesting that you quote 1.5%"

Or perhaps it's 10% as the most recent Catholic Voices opinion survey suggests. Of course, that inconvenient figure is quietly brushed under the carpet here each time even though the source of it is a religious one. Our bluedog prefers to choose his facts for convenience, I think.

17 June 2012 at 18:32  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

@Danjo,

I take your point- 10% of global population would mean that gays outnumber the Roman Catholics? (I think about 1 in 7 of earth's population is Catholic?).

I would also say it is suprising that the Times- considered by inter-galactic governments to be the mouthpeice of the British government- is leading with this story. What about the oncoming storm of the elections in the Holy Orthodox Byzantine Empire, which is on the verge of default and could distrupt the whole universal economy?

17 June 2012 at 18:56  
Blogger Alpha Draconis said...

@Dodo no I don't recognise that song at all. Meatloaf is still popular - "I would do anything for love" has sold over 1 quadrillion copies in the interstellar market.

17 June 2012 at 18:58  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Well call it 2%. But that tiny amount is extremely vocal, and flag flying. The site “Pink Behinds” claims twenty two thousand followers, out of say 1.2 million in the UK.

17 June 2012 at 18:58  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

IanCad

Of course the Church of Rome nullified the First and Fourth Commandments. Just like we Catholics 'worship' statues and regard Mary as a 'Goddess'! How silly.

The Catholic Church is the Apostolic Church directly commissioned by Christ. And how could a 21st century Church of billions ORGANISE itself in the same way as the 1st century Church?

I take it you're not an Anglican.

17 June 2012 at 19:00  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

Of coure we are officially deemed 'followers' of the 'Pink Bottom' shite, even though we've been excommicated and all our posts deleted. Try deregistering. It can't be done!

17 June 2012 at 19:03  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Excuse the typo:
*site*

17 June 2012 at 19:03  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Alpha

"But I wont do that" is understood in what sense in your time?

17 June 2012 at 19:05  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Dodo. Always imagined it had something to do ‘offal’, if you will...

17 June 2012 at 19:17  
Blogger Guglielmo Marinaro said...

Flossie, no matter what you may think of the Terrence Higgins Trust material, perhaps you could kindly explain to us what the hell it has to do with whether or not gay couples should be allowed to get married. There's plenty of equally graphic material available on heterosexual sex, and all the far out and dangerous practices engaged in by a minority of gays are also engaged in by a minority of straights, but I have yet to hear anyone use this fact to castigate heterosexual couples or to argue that they shouldn't be allowed to get married. Nor have I heard anyone argue that heterosexual couples marrying means that these practices are going to be taught to schoolchildren. Have you ever considered making some sort of contact with reality?

17 June 2012 at 19:32  
Blogger IanCad said...

Dodo @ 19:00,

You are misquoting me. I did not mention the First Commandment, I referred to the Second. You know, the one about graven images. The one that was done away with. Are you telling me Rome didn't change the Sabbath day from the Seventh Day to the First, a direct transgression of the Fourth Commandment?
Come on Dodo you know better.
Perhaps you don't.
You are now bringing up the fallacy of Apostolic Succession which is based on the Romish claim that Peter is The Rock. We've been there before several times on this blog. Allow me to re-post this:

Peter is not The Rock. Jesus Christ is. In the Old Testament Christ is identified as The Rock many times. Deut. 32:3-4, 1 Sam. 2:2, 2 Sam. 22:23-32, Isaiah 44:8 are just a few. Peter refers to Christ as The Rock three times; Acts 4:11-12, 1 Peter 2:3-6, 1 Peter 2:7-8. Paul states the same four times; 1 Cor. 10:4, 1 Cor. 3:11, Eph. 2:19-20, Romans 9-33. Three times Our Lord declares the same; Luke 20:17-18, Matt. 21:42-44, Mark 12:10-11. Peter's tomb is, allegedly, in St. Peter's. Indeed it is the centre of worship. Peter is dead. He did not rise. As the gates of Hell (the grave) shall not prevail against Christ's Church this presents a problem for Rome. Christ has risen from the grave. His Church prevails.
If Jesus had given Peter Apostolic succession the shameful scene at the Last Supper of the disciples bickering over who should be the greatest would have been moot.
It was not until the year 445 that the then pope Leo 1st. promulgated the fallacy of Petrine Inheritance. This was a time of schism and rivalry among the bishops. Thus, Leo claimed for himself lineage from the Apostle.
We must be wary of the stinking puddles of men's traditions

17 June 2012 at 19:44  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

Ummm, now DanJ0 has gone all quiet our other wee friend has returned to bang the homosexual drum.

He has the affront to say:

" ... all the far out and dangerous practices engaged in by a minority of gays are also engaged in by a minority of straights."

So anal sex and other lurid practices are minority pursuits amongst homosexuals? My, my, that'll be news to the STI clinicians.

And then this:

"Nor have I heard anyone argue that heterosexual couples marrying means that these practices are going to be taught to school children."

No, hetrosexual perversions will not be taught, quite right too. However, homosexuality once it acquires equal 'marital' status means sex education must include mainstream homosexual acts. Not to do so would be discriminatory. And what are these? I mean, do they just hold hands?

Marinaro

Have you ever considered making some sort of contact with reality?

17 June 2012 at 19:45  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

So, tell me IanCad towhich protestant cult do you belong?

17 June 2012 at 19:47  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Guglielmo Marinaro. Nor have I heard anyone argue that heterosexual couples marrying means that these practices are going to be taught to schoolchildren,

Think you mean ‘homosexual’ up there. And you know very well that Higgins is out for that very end. It would be disingenuous of you to state otherwise. Oddly enough, educating children in this way is more likely to produce teenage raving homophobes rather than swell gay numbers or make sexually confused children think any better about themselves...

I say old fruit, do pass on my regrets to all ones friends at your pink site, and pass on regrets that the Inspector is no longer able to have intercourse with them...

17 June 2012 at 19:51  
Blogger IanCad said...

Dodo,

As I have stated on this site before:
I am a Seventh Day Adventist.

17 June 2012 at 19:57  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

Guglielmo Marinaro. {AHEM} That first regret should have been ‘regards’

Have re-read your comment, and now realise what you are saying. A well crafted post, from a slippery character used to handling body lube, as one might expect. Anything to justify your carnal desires, and that means SSM, what !

17 June 2012 at 20:03  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

IanCad

And you dare suggest Catholics of being unbiblical?

Where in the bible can you find support for the distinctive teachings you adhere to? The "unconscious state of the dead" or "soul sleep"; the "Great Disappointment" and the "Investigative Judgment".

It is for these very reasons Christ said:

" ... thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever thou shalt bind upon earth, it shall be bound also in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose upon earth, it shall be loosed also in heaven."

17 June 2012 at 20:08  
Blogger Phil Roberts said...

Guglielmo Marinaro

I was going to comment but the Inspector beat me to it

Well done Inspector. I agree totally except, I would not want to have intercourse with anyone on the pink site!

Phil

17 June 2012 at 20:19  
Blogger IanCad said...

Dodo @ 20:08 wrote:

"Where in the bible can you find support for the distinctive teachings you adhere
to? The "unconscious state of the dead" or "soul sleep"; the "Great
Disappointment" and the "Investigative Judgment"


Where to start!?

"The State of The Dead": (A misunderstanding of which is a direct path to spiritualism.)

Job 14:12 "So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep."
John 11:11-14. The story of Lazarus.
Psalms 115:17 "The dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence."
Ecclesiastes 9:5 "For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten."


"The Judgement prior to the return of Our Lord:" (Plenty of clear teaching here.)

Hebrews 9:27 "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:"
Romans 14:10 " But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ."
Matthew 12:36 " But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment"
Revelation 22:12 "And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be."

"The Great Disappointment"

A world wide movement of many faiths, known as the "Great Awakening" predicted that Christ would return in 1844. That this did not occur is self evident, The Adventist Church was not established until 1863.

The name "Seventh Day Adventist" is reflective of our doctrines and our hopes.
It seems passing strange where, as of late, so much debate has been revolving around the institute of marriage, it has been little noted that it, along with The Sabbath is one of the two ordinances established at The Creation.
The robust defence of the one contrasts ill with the rejection of the other.

17 June 2012 at 21:48  
Blogger anna anglican said...

@Ian

I wouldn't bother - your wasting your time. You'll get repeatedly attacked by Dodo, his cum Inspector and the Mistress Creeddy. If you've got a tough enough skin...

17 June 2012 at 22:28  
Blogger bluedog said...

Captain Alpha Draconis @ 17.57 and 18.06, we have much in common, in so far as this communicant is an alpha dog and a member of the deposed ruling class.

Thanks to a change in the legislation in the laws of our planet, very small and noisy minorities are able to exert enormous influence over the majority of taxpayers and voters. As these 'Homosexuals', as they are known, do not breed, their wages and other income can be used to satisfy their hedonistic whims, having no other responsibilities. Without puppies, the Homosexuals have time on their hands. They are using this time and their money to try and subvert our civilisation from within so that they become our masters and we their slaves, supporting their lifestyle. One hears rumours that their sexual practices are very strange and that many of these 'Homosexuals' have fallen ill as a result. Of course we, the common dogs, pay the taxes that are now used to buy drugs needed to cure the 'Homosexuals' and our pups have to nurse them.

Help us, Great Captain, in our hour of need, we Earthly dogs are much troubled by our oppressors.

17 June 2012 at 22:32  
Blogger Naomi King said...

The word of the LORD came unto me, saying, Son of man, I have made thee a watchman unto the house of Israel: therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me. When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand. Yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.

17 June 2012 at 22:34  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

The Inspector wishes it to be known that he respects all varieties of the Christian religion, though he of course is RC, and is especially supportive of Anglicanism. Beware of scurrilous maids telling you otherwise...

17 June 2012 at 22:48  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

Oh I know my limitations and am not inclined to engage in dsicussions with Seventh Day Adventists. It would be as fruitful as discussions with len.

Do you actually know the views of Seventh Day Adventists? Maybe you should find out. They regard themselves as the 'remnant church' and the Pope as the anti-Christ set upon destroying them and leading protestants astray through Sunday worship.

Ellen White, regarded by them as a prophetess, had a series of 'visions' following a blow to the head as a child. She was shown the future by 'angels'. She wrote:

"His word has given warning of the impending danger; let this be unheeded, and the Protestant world will learn what the purposes of Rome really are, only when it is too late to escape the snare. She is silently growing into power. Her doctrines are exerting their influence in legislative halls, in the churches, and in the hearts of men. She is piling up her lofty and massive structures in the secret recesses of which her former persecutions will be repeated. Stealthily and unsuspectedly she is strengthening her forces to further her own ends when the time shall come for her to strike. All that she desires is vantage ground, and this is already being given her. We shall soon see and shall feel what the purpose of the Roman element is. Whoever shall believe and obey the word of God will thereby incur reproach and persecution.

And let it be remembered, it is the boast of Rome that she never changes ... And had she but the power, she would put them in practice with as much vigor now as in past centuries. Protestants little know what they are doing when they propose to accept the aid of Rome in the work of Sunday exaltation. While they are bent upon the accomplishment of their purpose, Rome is aiming to re-establish her power, to recover her lost supremacy."


Not really the kind of nonsense I want to get drawn into arguing about!

18 June 2012 at 00:08  
Blogger Oswin said...

Insufferable hypocrite ...

18 June 2012 at 03:35  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

Ania (Anglican for this week)

Sophie Scholl and C S Lewis are the two of the finest Christians deserving of sainthoods imo. Both are of the Protestant faith.

When I stated "true Christians" I was not intending that Catholics are the only true Christians.On many occasions on this site I have been openly critical of the hypocrisy of Catholics as you well know. My intention was to differentiate between Christians who defend a cause rather than someone like yourself (a half baked fence sitter) who does not defend her homosexuality or her faith.Your new found faith (nor your old) supports ssm. Do you?

I should imagine that lesbians are attracted to someone with strength of character so be prepared to be on your own for the rest of your life unless you develop a backbone in the meantime.

18 June 2012 at 03:56  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

correction:
Neither your new faith (nor your old) supports ssm.

18 June 2012 at 06:53  
Blogger Naomi King said...

Here are two wonderful testimonies of homosexuals who have moved out of their former "gay scene" lifestyles and found peace and real joy in Christ and heterosexual identity. PRAISE GOD. IT IS SO HEARTENING IN THIS SORDID BUSINESS THAT MR CAMERON HAS DRAGGED US ALL INTO.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uTcW8BHIzaM&feature=g-vrec

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lq6pea_R6_E&feature=related

18 June 2012 at 07:30  
Blogger Naomi King said...

We are glad enough to tell you glad tidings of good things, but he that is to be useful must be willing to speak unpleasant things. Brothers and Sisters, are you ready when you meet with careless people to tell them Truths of God that will be unpalatable to them! And when they are awakened, are you willing, in God’s name, to try and beat to pieces their refuges of lies—to tell them plainly of the mistakes that they are so fond of and point them to the only way of salvation? You and I cannot be useful if we want to be sweet as honey in the mouths of men!

God will never bless us if we wish to please men so that they may think well of us. Are you willing to tell them what will break your own heart in the telling and break theirs in the hearing? If not, you are not fit to serve the Lord! You must be willing to go and speak for God though you will be rejected! God says, “They will not listen unto you, for they will not listen unto Me.” If they reject the Master, will they receive the servant? They took up stones to stone your own dear Lord and Master! And they finally took nails to fasten Him to the Cross! Do you think they will listen to you?

If God is to bless you, dear Friend, you must be willing to bear witness for Him even if none should ever believe a word you say—because in so doing you will deliver your soul!

18 June 2012 at 07:44  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Oswin

Please try not to share your own personal recriminations on line. Your personal prayers are private, after ll..

18 June 2012 at 11:35  
Blogger Jon said...

Shacklefree said "The problem with the British people is that they vote on economics instead of the gospel."

LOL! Don't worry, the Inspector will be starting a party for loons and racists when he finds out that UKIP won't let him use all manner of outlandish words to describe people with different coloured skin. Maybe the British people will read the Gospel and vote Inspector Party, but I rather doubt it!

18 June 2012 at 12:15  
Blogger Cressida de Nova said...

I must say Inspector, Jon has a point about your non pc commentary which could be interpreted as discriminatory. You mention pink bottoms quite often but never mention yellow, brown or black ones.It is unchristian to exclude bums on the basis of colour and you should open your heart to all regardless of colour and race.Naomi no doubt would have a scriptural quote to support this in her recipe or similar folder... I'm sure.

18 June 2012 at 13:18  
Blogger Oswin said...

Dodo: when responding to you I often DO take a deeper look at myself; in that, you have proved useful. I do so dislike the thought of being hypocritical, but with you as a yardstick, my own pettinesses don't seem so bad. Which is something I must be wary of, for the sake of my own soul.

18 June 2012 at 16:09  
Blogger Office of Inspector General said...

More scurrilous criticism, this time from Jon & Cressida.

As you well know, the Inspector has no problem with the colour of people’s skin. Confusion lies in that two of the biggest pains in the arse in the UK just so happen to have different coloured skin. Viz Jamaicans and sub continent Islam.

He does actually love all of God’s human creation, though he does admit to wondering why the Almighty bothered with a few of our brother races. Somalis come to mind here when they’re dressing up as pirates…

18 June 2012 at 18:40  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Inspector

You should include yellow, black and brown bottoms unless you have evidence people from these ethnic backgrounds never practice homosexuality.

Oswin
Thank you; if I can help someone along the way, then my life has not been in vain. However, I wouldn't necessarily use me as a yardstick!

18 June 2012 at 18:54  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Oh hi Credessia,

Will you become one of those French tax exiles in South Kensington, now that President 'Olland has won in France?

Just of interest why do you keep writing my name Ania- I'm not Polish!

In respect of your post :
I would say that being a moderate is quite a good thing. You know what happens when people become fundamentalist don't you- sure they have 'strong' opinions (in your view this is a good thing), but look at some of the logical consequences of that lack of restraint or moderation, both in this world now and in past history.

As for the view that liberal Christianity is wrong and the antithesis of the Roman Church, I think your Dodo gave me a good starting point :

" And how could a 21st century Church of billions ORGANISE itself in the same way as the 1st century Church? "

You see even the arch conservative Catholic Doodo admits that we have moved on from the 1st Century AD, and whilst the spirit of Christianity is still the same- Love, hope , charity, personal betterment, life- the letter of it has moved with the centuries. And this is a fact. Whether you like it or not. So I don't really think my views are that outward. Don't forget people often used to use the Bible to justify slavery, but what Priest or Pope or Minister would dare do so now?

Ps- I've left the Judaism argument out because it chimes in well with what I'm going to say to Mrs King.

18 June 2012 at 19:01  
Blogger anna anglican said...

Actually I've kept my response to Mrs King short and sweet.

However, I am still Jewish- like being gay I cannot take that away from myself. As you should know from Jewish traditions, if your mother is Jewish.... But we can discuss my so called conversion (or rather lack of it) as you put it at another time.

18 June 2012 at 19:08  
Blogger The Way of Dodo the Dude said...

Anna

Now that wasn't quite what I meant! You mustn't quote me out of context. I was referring to the silly notion that billions of believers can be one church meeting in small houses on a Saturday or Sunday! All following their own theologies and beliefs! Crazy idea.

There can be no compromise at all with fundamental Christian values and the laws of God and nature. Active homosexuality and same sex 'marriage' is just not something one can negotiate about and remain a true Christian

18 June 2012 at 20:06  

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