Friday, January 17, 2014

The slaughter of Syria's Christians - doing nothing is not an option

This young boy sleeps in between the graves of his dead parents. The location is unknown, except for it being somewhere in Syria. The faith of the boy is unknown, but it is immaterial. The suffering of innocents breaks the heart. The grieving of a child is an agony shared by the whole of humanity. His loss is bottomless; his despair boundless; his tears endless.

He is just one child in a sea of suffering in which thousands are being butchered and millions displaced. As ever, the Christians are getting it worst. According to Aid to the Church in Need (ACN), violence against Christians in Syria is becoming "one of the worst persecutions endured by Christians in this part of the third millennium". Christianity risks being expunged from the region altogether. Another report talks of Christians being beheaded simply for wearing a cross, and tells us that "more than 600,000 Christians - a third of the total Syrian faithful - are internally displaced or living as refugees in neighboring countries".

Other estimates put the figure at 1.3 million - that is two thirds of the entire Christian population of Syria. They have no destiny and serve no purpose: they are victims fate and chance. We can talk of the "Christian hope" and waffle on about God's promises and the unfathomable peace of Christ. But when you are cold and hungry, words bring little comfort. And when you're grieving for your mum and dad, a rational appeal to God's coming vindication offers absolutely nothing.

Apparently the UK is giving aid, along with the rest of the EU, which amounts to millions of pounds. That's nice, but this boy needs a hug, a shoulder, and new familial relationships to begin to heal his lamenting spirit. He doesn't understand talk of the anti-Assad forces, Al-Qaeda or the Free Syrian Army. He doesn't do politics. He just wants to put his arms around his parents and be loved again.

And his story - whatever it is - will be just one among the multitudes of the innocent dead. When St John saw the martyred souls beneath the altar crying "How long?" (Rev 6:9f), he saw the question as the Old Testament prophets had left it:
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever (Dan 12:2f).
Outstanding injustice awaits the final intervention of God to judge this world and to give life to the dead. Daniel expresses the limitations of a purely cosmological theodicy in chapters 4 and 5. It is the opacity of history, the sealed scroll in God's hand, that reduces John to tears. It is the revelation of the Lion of Judah, who is also the sacrificed Lamb of God, which affords us a glimpse of joy that evil and suffering are made intelligible.

But this doesn't comfort the grieving children of Homs, Maaloula or Aleppo. We can pray and/or send money. Or we can physically go there and weep with those who weep. We can petition the Government to open our borders and welcome them as we should all widows and orphans. Whatever or whichever, doing nothing is not an option.


Blogger Corrigan said...

You believe something must be done; what do you suggest that won't make it worse?

17 January 2014 at 10:08  
Blogger 1markconway said...

Sooner or later we'll have to go in to these places properly and impose our freedoms upon them. I know that sounds like an oxymoron but we can't keep expending lives and $billions and then handing back the keys to corrupt, ruthless individuals who use religion to justify their ongoing butchery and enslavement, particularly of women.

17 January 2014 at 10:16  
Blogger Ars Hendrik said...

Aid to the Church in Need (ACN), cited at the head of this very moving article, tirelessly fights for the rights of Christians worldwide, directly supporting Christians in the most oppressive countries and fighting an indifferent media to try and promote the reality of what is really happening (especially in countries where the 'religion of peace' is ascendant).

Cranmer's fundraising link is to Save the Children, a very worthy charity, but if you want directly to support persecuted and often ignored Christians could I also suggest a donation to ACN, here:

17 January 2014 at 10:26  
Blogger John Thomas said...

"impose our freedoms upon them" (1markconway) - This smacks of the efforts, in the past to try to force Middle Eastern countries to accept western-style democracy (which was tried in Iraq, etc,) and which will NEVER, can never, happeen, for many reasons

17 January 2014 at 10:33  
Blogger 1markconway said...

Thank you John. I think I'd need a bit more to chew on than 'for many reasons'. My comment comes from thoughts outlined here:

Which came about following the Syrian situation in which we couldn't choose between one side or the other. Anyway just if you're interested, thoughts are explained more fully in the blog.

17 January 2014 at 10:43  
Blogger Jim McLean said...

I am with 1Markconway. We have to stop pissing about and pretending we care about both the rights of the persecuted and the persecutors.

Either we make a conscious decision to leave it in the hands of God and human evolution / development, or we go in to impose / colonise a country that is backward and force it to move into the 21st Century.

I don't care which. If we decide to leave well alone and let them work things out, then we have to stop giving aid and money. Then, after millions of have perished, they may get back on an even keel.

If we decide to help, then we help in a way that benefits the persecuted and the aid givers. And we shouldn't worry about being neo-colonialsts or any other label that is put on us.

What we are currently doing is simply prolonging the agony.

17 January 2014 at 10:58  
Blogger E.xtra S.ensory Blofeld + Tiddles said...

"We can petition the Government to open our borders and welcome them as we should all widows and orphans. Whatever or whichever, doing nothing is not an option."

Ernst is of the opinion that should this occur, it would be the persecuting of the 'religion of peace' that our weak, pathetic government would sanction access to the UK and NOT the persecuted followers and our brethren of the Prince of Peace?


17 January 2014 at 11:19  
Blogger Ariadne said...

I'm very sorry to see that the photograph is being reported in Russia as a fake, plagiarised, not in Syria.

Will see if I can find out more but fakery doesn't condemn sympathy for the plight of Syrians.

"Fooled thou must be, though wisest of the wise: Then be the fool of virtue, not of vice."

17 January 2014 at 11:28  
Blogger Ariadne said...

A Google image search hasn't found another copy so the above could be Russian disinformation.

17 January 2014 at 11:31  
Blogger Seashell said...

It's staged for Western audiences LOL

17 January 2014 at 11:50  
Blogger IanCad said...

How terrible YG,

We can pray, send money and offer them comfort in our fair land.

We owe them that at least.
How many times do we need to learn the same lesson?

Like it or not, given the religous factionalism in the Muslim world, we must support strong governments over there, if their rule does, in general, offer some security to ethnic and religious minorities.

Or, at least, tolerate them.

Democracy does not always suit. It is, essentially another religion. One swallowed hook line and sinker by the inexperienced and naive.

We have much to answer for and make right.

A good start would be for the serial bencher, William Hague, to resign.

When, O when, will we be governed by men of judgement and integrity?

17 January 2014 at 11:54  
Blogger carl jacobs said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

17 January 2014 at 12:05  
Blogger carl jacobs said...

To whom it may concern.

Don't bother with Seashell's link. It has nothing to do with the validity of the picture. It is an instance of vulgar humor.

To Seashell

Why would you post that foolishness and what possibly I could you find funny about this thread. The picture is incidental and symbolic. The subject matter is real enough and not something about which to laugh.


17 January 2014 at 12:06  
Blogger Ariadne said...

Nothing changes the real message.

A dying child

Words are not of much use.

17 January 2014 at 12:18  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Lost in thought and sorrow. Mere words can not cope with this truly appalling situation.

The comment of IanCad @ 11.54 resonates with me: -

"When O when will we governed by men of judgement and integrity?"

17 January 2014 at 12:47  
Blogger The Explorer said...

Credo of the Muslim Brotherhood I came across recently:

"Allah is our objective; the Quran is our law; the Prophet is our leader; Jihad is our way; and dying in the way of Allah is the highest of our aspirations."

Not directly relevant to the Syrian situation, but pertinent in the wider picture of the West's dealings with the Religion of Peace.

17 January 2014 at 13:14  
Blogger Lush Rimbaugh said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

17 January 2014 at 13:36  
Blogger Lush Rimbaugh said...

The article is clear and important. But please note that the picture is part of an art project. The boys parents are not dead:

17 January 2014 at 13:42  
Blogger seanrobsville said...

Tony Blair and Gordon Brown bragged that they were going to 'rub the English people's noses in diversity' by importing millions of Muslims. But what they didn't realise is that Islam doesn't bring diversity: it brings monoculturalism. Islam cannot withstand competition and is programmed to eliminate all competing worldviews by genocide.

Last week it was revealed 10% of children under five in England are Muslim, with the proportion expected to increase geometrically due to rapid breeding. In twenty years time these will be the Sharia-enforcing vigilantes patrollling our streets (or what once were our streets).

Demography is destiny, and what we see happening in Syria is the endgame of what will inevitably happen in Britain within the lifetime of our grandchildren.

Even UKIP can't reverse this process.

17 January 2014 at 14:09  
Blogger Edward Spalton said...

I agree with Corrigan here. From Yugoslavia onwards the results of Western intervention have been bad and have got worse.

It is an unfortunate fact that, in most Arab Muslim countries, the more democratic a regime is (in the sense of following the wishes of the people), the more it is likely to persecute Christians or, at the very least, make them second class citizens in accordance with Sharia concepts. The states which protected their Christian minorities (like Iraq and Syria) were/are rather beastly dictatorships but there was religious tolerance and most people could get on with their lives.

Neither is this unfortunate boy (assuming the photo to be genuine) a victim of "fate" but of deliberate US/Western policy to topple the Assad regime with the almost certain consequence of bringing in a more or less Islamist regime, had it been successful. The Saudis and others who have done America's bidding in helping the destabilisation of Syria are not in the business of enlightened toleration.

The situation is somewhat akin to Yugoslavia where the West (especially Germany) worked to destabilise the state for years, financed, armed and encouraged separatist movements and then used the resulting mayhem as an excuse for "humanitarian intervention".

Then Russia was flat on the floor and impotent. Now it is not and I have the impression that Mr. Putin is far more realistic about the situation than the Western powers which kidded themselves about the myth of the "Arab Spring"and really do seem to have believed their own propaganda.

17 January 2014 at 14:43  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

What about all the other Christians around the world that are also being slaughtered and maimed? We can't take them all in. We have sent, and continue to send aid. Mr Hague could be more informative by telling us how many blankets, food, water, and medical supplies we have actually given
I would think as it's going on so long the next thing would be to erect makeshift tents as classrooms to be able to teach children so we could send those in the camps books Maths and English then they will have learnt something.

I don't know about those children and families trapped in the war zones in Syria, they need more people like Mother Meriam to try and get them out to camps in Jordan. At least in a camp, families and friends can stick together and support each other as they are all in the same boat, whereas if you start sending a few to Britain and to other western countries those left behind perish.

When Nicolae Ceaușescu fell and the dire situation of thousands of babies in Romania was broadcast the local Church where I was appealed for us all to make up a shoe box of baby/children’s clothes, a soft toy, baby food, formulae milk etc... many hundreds of people did this and the Church sent it on to the orphanages. I guess people didn't feel so helpless by doing this.

But when all is said and done it's going to have to be settled around the table in the Geneva II.
The many Jihad's that are destabilising and wrecking havoc in Syria somehow are going to have to be brought to heel and for that the Yanks and Prince Bandar Bush are going to have to stop arming and encouraging them.

17 January 2014 at 15:32  
Blogger James said...

As ever, the Christians are getting it worst

Yeah, right. Tell that to Muslims fleeing the Christians with guns and machetes in the Central African Republic.

17 January 2014 at 16:06  
Blogger John Thomas said...

Marie: "send those in the camps books Maths and English then they will have learnt something" - what if the Islamists bomb the schools and stop the education? - They're supposed to do this in Nigeria.
"have to be brought to heel" - what's going to do that? Only military intervention, like the west tried in Afganistan with the Taliban ... and did it work?
Indeed, taking every threatened Christian in the world into Britain would be impossible. A counsel of despair ...? Well, I'll admit I can't think of a solution or strategy myself ...

17 January 2014 at 16:08  
Blogger Integrity said...

David Hussell said @ 11:54"When O when will we governed by men of judgement and integrity?"

At last someone is coming round to my way of thinking.

17 January 2014 at 16:37  
Blogger The Explorer said...

James @ 16:06

Who hit who first? Two clues.

1. It was a Muslim coalition that seized power and unleashed a wave of killing and looting.

2. The Christian militiamen call themselves "anti-balaka" = anti-machete. That's a BIG clue.

17 January 2014 at 16:43  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

John Thomas
You let Assad and his regime fight for their beloved country back after getting as many Christians and other innocents evacuated out of the war zones. (A dangerous operation)

I was talking about trying to educate the children that are in camps already in Jordan, as far as I know there is no war there.

17 January 2014 at 16:53  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Integrity @ 16.37

I was quoting, and agreeing with, IanCad @ 11.54, not you.

Please don't highjack my agreement with his comments.

I have no idea as to whether I agree with your thoughts on this post as, as far as I can see, you do not appear to have made any.

17 January 2014 at 17:03  
Blogger Len said...

Petitioning our Government to open its borders seems to be about the only option we have.
Sending more troops into Islamic Countries or supplying weapons to 'freedom fighters' seems to be counter productive.

17 January 2014 at 17:33  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

The image does look like it’s been staged. Note the amount of soil displaced by the ‘bodies’. What were they buried in - wardrobes ?

But it’s not the point, is it ? The real thing is taking place...

However, any attempt by the West to ‘improve’ the situation in Syria will inevitably involve aspiring to install democracy in the area. Which is the last thing those Islamic blighters need – to lead to a tyranny of the mass, no less. No, they need to be gripped firmly by the throat, and killed if they step out of line, by the only thing going that will save them from themselves and harming others – a dictator. One despairs as to why the West continues to go down the path of democracy for peoples who are just not of sufficient calibre to appreciate it. It is a poison to these lower developed types. They are just not civilised enough to cope with it. It is no ones fault – that is how it is. There is no blame or guilt involved here.

The Syrians have a dictator. Support him, and the killing of Christians will stop…

17 January 2014 at 17:46  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

And where are they all going to live and work????? You're not thinking straight.

17 January 2014 at 17:50  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Gentlemen, interesting article to be found if you google…

By a former Pakistan ambassador to the UN, Munir Ackram. The poor sod is lamenting divisions within Islam which is preventing…well, read what he says…

“This sectarian contest obviously has further weakened the ability of Muslim states to promote pan-Islamic objectives. These pan-Islamic objectives would normally be to protect and promote Muslim communities and groups which face discrimination, oppression and violence from non-Muslim sources.”

This is from a former ambassador, of all people. (Though one has long thought you don’t get invited to join the elite in Pakistan unless you are at least as barking as the rest of them. Don’t want anyone sticking out like a sore thumb, what ! Sure Memsahib Warsi would agree)

The item does have a comments section and interestingly, he is panned by his own side. Presumably the people on the ground, muslims as they are, who have to deal with their faiths image as recognized by the rest of the world. They are not happy about that one bit…

Hope continues to shine eternal, as they say…

17 January 2014 at 17:51  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Len. We do have one other option. We could send you out there. Christ be with you, lad...

17 January 2014 at 17:54  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

...and don’t forget to take your anti Roman Catholic bigotry with you. We can’t have you leaving that behind, now can we ?

17 January 2014 at 18:00  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said... will be a comfort for you, before martyrdom, you lucky blighter.

17 January 2014 at 18:04  
Blogger Phil Roberts said...


We could send Len. He could preach the "Proper Gospel" to both sides and before you know what they will all be best friends, hugging each other and calling each other "mate"

Don't get me wrong I would love it to happen.

I am not sure than Len's suggestion of bringing them over to fight each other in say, Gloucestershire instead is really a solution.


17 January 2014 at 18:10  
Blogger Unknown said...

Good topic but the photo is fake.

17 January 2014 at 18:18  
Blogger Unknown said...

Good topic but the photo is a fake.

17 January 2014 at 18:18  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Phil. The Syrians don’t need the 'proper gospel' as defined by born again frauds when they have a dictator who loves them instead...

17 January 2014 at 18:45  
Blogger The Explorer said...

Inspector in fine fighting fettle.

Don't let him near a machete!

17 January 2014 at 19:01  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Inspector @ 17.46

asks the question that many ordinary people in the west have been asking, namely, when will the political and media "establishment" learn the obvious, that democracy is suitable for some countries, having evolved there slowly, having grown out of its soil, being rooted in the religious/philosophical cultural background of the west, but it cannot be naively imposed on Muslim cultures.

For those countries, the best hope of some sort of peace and stability, if not freedom, especially for the minorities, is a dictator, a strongman, who is hopefully sane. Is Iraq a better place now thanks to Bush and Blair? Is Afghanistan a better place ? Time will tell, but I have my suspicions. Then there's Libya, which we bombed. Fortunately we stayed out of Egypt. But the army had to seize power again to prevent total meltdown.

The description from the BBC of the "Arab Spring" has a bitter, hollow ring about it, but typifies the wide eyed stupidity and naivety of many of the left/liberal world view.

Squaring up to the situation, after the shock of the initial image, I see only two courses of action : -

1. For the west to take control - a latter day colony, really, and rule through a local ruler, Raj style.
2. To keep out of it.

Have I overlooked other options ? Obviously option 2 must be accompanied by giving humanitarian aid.

Neither of these two courses of action above appeals to me. Passing resolutions in the UN or the EU, or Little Keep Smiling Parish Council, will achieve nothing, except making the politicians feel better. It would be a moral gesture I suppose, to give it a positive description, but not a life will be saved. So desperate.

17 January 2014 at 20:10  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

"We can talk of the "Christian hope" and waffle on about God's promises and the unfathomable peace of Christ. But when you are cold and hungry, words bring little comfort. And when you're grieving for your mum and dad, a rational appeal to God's coming vindication offers absolutely nothing."

How very, very true.

These poor people don't need words, they need practical and spiritual assistance. They need our prayers, our aid through giving to Christian charities and, if they want to leave, our governments should offer them and secure them safe passage to Christian lands.

17 January 2014 at 20:45  
Blogger Len said...

Well I seem to have rattled someones cage.... without even trying.

17 January 2014 at 20:55  
Blogger Len said...

When The inspector settles down and wipes the foam off his lips and gets his 'swivel eyes' focused perhaps we could get some serious commenting done?.

17 January 2014 at 20:59  
Blogger Corrigan said...

Come off it, Len. "Serious commenting" was never your bag.

17 January 2014 at 21:00  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

One has long been impressed by our national leaders, of any political colour, fawning over the ‘model’ dictatorship of Saudi Arabia. Of course, those darlings are up to their ankles in oil, so no surprise there then.

But here is a surprise - SYRIA HAS OIL !

Come on Cameron and Haig, get those weapons off to Assad poste haste. In gratitude, he’s bound to let us have our need of the black stuff at preferential rates in return. And don’t try to impress upon this man that you two have principles...

17 January 2014 at 21:31  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

Inspector, Happy Jack points out that Russia is all ready on the case and ahead of the game. They have been supporting Assad for 3 years and are now increasing supplies to him of weapons and bombs. They've also stopped the West from weakening Assad. The rebels are weakening.

The U.S. State Department are against this involvement by Russia and have "great concerns about the role that Russia is playing in continuing to enable the Assad regime of brutalizing the Syrian people."

No word about Christian deaths and suffering.

17 January 2014 at 23:51  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

No Inspector, they have to do it themselves otherwise they'll end up like Iraq and Afghanistan, they have enough weapons. If we start getting involved it's taking sides and others with interests there will also pile in, next thing is we'll be sending men too and end up embroiled in someone else’s war. Remember Parliament said no last year to military intervention and rightly so. We can negotiate prices nearer the time. The resources have to be mined first and the pipelines and mining contracts agreed, therein lies all the trouble. Prince Bandit has to accept that the Saudi's are not the only oil producers, that they must compete more. But, as oil is their main source of income it's about time they stopped all their backward behaviours and became more creative to ensure income is from other industries too.

18 January 2014 at 00:09  
Blogger Theo said...

7 The angel of Adonai found her by a spring in the desert, the spring on the road to Shur, 8 and said, “Hagar! Sarai’s slave-girl! Where have you come from, and where are you going?” She answered, “I’m running away from my mistress Sarai.” 9 The angel of Adonai said to her, “Go back to your mistress, and submit to her authority.” 10 The angel of Adonai said to her, “I will greatly increase your descendants; there will be so many that it will be impossible to count them.” 11 The angel of Adonai said to her, “Look, you are pregnant, and you will give birth to a son. You are to call him Yishma‘el [God pays attention] because Adonai has paid attention to your misery. 12 He will be a wild donkey of a man, with his hand against everyone and everyone’s hand against him, living his life at odds with all his kinsmen.” Genesis 16: 7-12

So it has been prophesied. The children of Ishmael will continue to rage!

18 January 2014 at 08:57  
Blogger Harry-ca-Nab said...

The Commentator sums up very well what has/is going on.

That idiot Williams had little or nothing to say and now Welby has gone quiet again.

The CofE, other Christian Churches and, moreover, Western Governments have blood on their hands.

18 January 2014 at 09:25  
Blogger The Explorer said...

Islam is a religion of peace. There will be peace when the whole world has submitted to Allah.

That may be an oversimplification. Will it be a Sunni peace or a Shia peace? More fighting might be needed to decide which version of peace prevails.

18 January 2014 at 10:03  
Blogger Roy said...

As others have pointed out, Western intervention in other countries in recent decades has not had very happy results. British intervention in Sierra Leone is about the only exception to this rule that I can think of. Perhaps French intervention in some of their former African colonies could also be counted a success, but I don't know much about that and there current efforts seem to have run into difficulties.

In the case of the Middle East our intervention over the past century has created problems everywhere. The only positive results were the liberation of the Arabs from Turkish rule, so that they could oppress each other instead, and the creation of the state of Israel, which has itself led to many of the current problems.

The defeat of the Germans and Italians in North Africa and the Mediterranean should also be added to the plus side.

If the West were to use armed force to intervene again in the Arab world we would probably have to remain there as long as the British did in India to effect a substantial transformation of those societies.

Even in India our intervention was only partly successful. Although India is "the world's biggest democracy," developments in other parts of the Raj, namely Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka and Burma have not been so good. Even India still has severe social problems (quite apart from those involving large, though admittedly declining, numbers living in poverty) as shown by recent cases of mass rape, and the practice of selective abortion of girls.

18 January 2014 at 12:28  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Interesting turn of phrase from the US State Department, Jack. To suggest that a people brutalised by their own religion can be further brutalised...

Marie, when putting down muslim grass roots insurrection, you can never have too many weapons. One does agree with you on there being no requisite to lose a single British serviceman to that countries internal affairs.

Still, President Putin is on the right side. One can only admire him for that. The Inspector knows a man who shook hands with Gorbachev when he and his wife attended the Cheltenham literary festival. The Inspector would be quite content just to stand in Putin’s shadow. One is particularly impressed by how he has not budged one inch from his stance to prevent Big Gay from turning Russia into another degenerate and diseased gay wonderland by banning the grooming of the young into the dubious lifestyle. Big Gay of course, is furious. Things had been going so well for them of late and now this setback. Well, they have resorted to direct action, and one is informed you won’t find Russian vodka in any gay bar in the UK as a result. Just how long Russia can keep going with this trade calamity in place is anyone’s guess, what !

18 January 2014 at 16:52  
Blogger Integrity said...

Dear Mr. Hussell, You seem to be a relative newcomer to the commentators on this site and I have welcomed your views. I find it strange therefore that you should lash out with such a volatile attack on my Post above. I apologise if I misconstrued the context of your reference to Integrity. But I had previously thought that you were a man of integrity and that you would want a Government with Integrity which has always been my principle objective since without Integrity you have chaos.
You probably have not noticed my opinions in the past since your post suggests you seem intent on only presenting your own opinions. Or this that not correct either. I hope that it is not. I don't expect you or anyone to agree with my hopes and desires for Integrity but I was shocked that you could not accept that some else might have the same views as yourself.
May God bless you richly in all that you do.

18 January 2014 at 18:27  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

David Hussle and Inspector, Happy Jack was interested in your thoughts on democracy.

Is any nation likely to run smoothly with equal votes for everybody over 18 years? And with regular elections where career politicians make all sorts of short term promises? Add the global economic and banking system and multi-national companies and options for nation states get smaller.

Modern democracy with votes for all, has a short history. So too has modern liberal capitalism and 'pluralistic' systems. It is too soon to judge it all but Jack certainly agrees it is not the best system for everyone, everywhere and for every time.

Jack says though that dictators or monarchs can be judged by how they rule and some are very wicked even if they establish order in their lands. There was a time when it was thought a better alternative to Assad existed.

18 January 2014 at 18:59  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Jack. A couple of suggestions to revive our stale democracy in the UK.

First. no one gets to stand as an MP until they are at least 40. One is sick of young party leaders, or Prime Ministers come to that. The only thing the young excel at is making mistakes.

Second. ALL mainstream parties to appear on each constituency voting slip. If they are deemed eligible to have a Party election Broadcast, then on they go. The Inspector wants to vote UKIP this time round. There was no UKIP candidate last time. And one doesn’t give a monkeys toss if liberal bleeding faint hearts would be appalled to see the BNP on their slip. Hard bloody luck...

18 January 2014 at 19:43  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

Inpector, Happy Jack has one or two other suggestions to add to your list.

First, votes only for the over 21
years of age, who can read, write and count above the level of a 10 year old, who are in employment or full time education (or unable to work for defined reasons) or those who have retired from work.

Second, Prime Ministers and Cabinet Ministers should be at least 50 years of age.

18 January 2014 at 19:55  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Now Now Jack, the literacy qualification is surprisingly restrictive coming from you. You know damn well half our valued immigrants would be disenfranchised...

18 January 2014 at 20:07  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said... well as a substantial chunk of indigenous Britons who had the bad luck to enjoy the benefit of a state education.

18 January 2014 at 20:11  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

By the way, on the subject of immigration, the Inspector heard from a Romanian official that he estimated the number of his countrymen that have arrived in the UK at between 15 and 25. No, not between 15,000 and 25,000. Just 15 to 25 souls.

This man joshes you not, and he thought Frank Carson was funny...

18 January 2014 at 20:26  
Blogger IanCad said...


Forty sounds about right to me.

Now, let's finesse this a bit more: Minimum voting age starts at twenty five, and then, only after five years of verifiable work or enterprise.
University grads will also have to comply with the same the work requirements after de-instutionalization.
In all other cases full voting rights will be granted upon reaching thirty years of age.

Something will, of course, have to be offered in return.

Perhaps dropping the legal age for the purchase and use of alcohol and tobacco to sixteen would do the trick.

We could also add the carrot of lowering the school-leaving age to fifteen.

Some adjustments would have to be made.
Employers should be indemnified by the Gov. against excessive insurance premiums as an incentive to employ these accident prone young folk.
A sub minimum wage would also be fair during the first two years of employment.

Hey! Inspector! Why don't we run this place?

18 January 2014 at 20:27  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Almost IanCad, but one believes 16 year olds should have the vote ( opposed to a ‘queer experience’, but another time for that one, eh).

Get the wretches to show some interest in something other than their damn phones and smart boxes, whatever they are.

One is mightily sore about not having a chance to vote for UKIP. However, if this man can convince others of his disaffection with our limited democratic process, and to state that on the voting slip with gusto, we might have the returning officer here saying “And ‘F__k Them All’ is duly elected as member for the constituency of the city of Gloucester”

We can dream...

18 January 2014 at 20:57  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Integrity @ 18.27

Apology accepted. Thank you.

But don't get my complaint out of proportion.

I did not "lash out with such a volatile attack", but merely asked you not to borrow, "highjack" my support of another's comments. And now you've apologized, so it's finished.

Yes of course I support politicians operating with integrity.

18 January 2014 at 21:03  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Happy Jack , Inspector

I agree with the broad thrust of what you're saying, which is that maturity is needed for both voters and far more so for the elected.

The Labour political gimmick (Harold Wilson?) to lower the voting age from 21 to 18 was an error. How many 18 year olds nowadays are sufficiently interested to consider carefully the merits of their options.
And certainly the progression of people from university to political researchers and then on into politics, becoming MPs at perhaps 30, without first gaining experience of the real world, and acquiring some skill or knowledge, beneficial for their performance as MPs, or more senior positions, is much to blame for the naivete and blunders of our Governments.

18 January 2014 at 21:09  
Blogger Phil Roberts said...

Inspector / Jack

Since we are reforming the voting system I think we should do away with votes altogether. People should be able and expected to bribe their MPs to pass the laws they want to the detriment of others and their own personal gain. Clearly if an MP takes the money but does not pass said laws or fails to get enough support then the person making the bribe should be able to get them out on some sort of pretext.

Oops I think I have just described the system we have already by mistake!


18 January 2014 at 21:17  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Revitalizing democracy .

I like the Swiss direct voting system. Now that's democracy.

I'm losing faith in representative democracy. Ours used to work, but it certainly doesn't now. They don't represent us anymore, just themselves, their friends and the EU.

18 January 2014 at 22:27  
Blogger Len said...

Whilst Europe pontificates the slaughter continues.We have opened our doors to everyone else why not the Syrian Christians?.

'Open doors' seem to be doing something though;

19 January 2014 at 10:22  
Blogger IanCad said...

Thanks for the link Len.
I've been wanting to make a small donation.
They may be the best choice.

I'm amazed. That you of all people would suggest lowering the voting age.
Can't judge a man by his posts.
You are right. Another time. Another thread.

19 January 2014 at 11:03  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

IanCad. We have never had a better informed youth. It’s all there for them. The television and on their PC. Now, youth is the precursor to adulthood, yet our young people are managing to push the concept of youth well into their twenties. Because they like being youthful. And being youthful means dodging responsibility. The sooner we can get these young types engaged in being responsible citizens, the better. And what better way than to get them involved in the democratic process early. If you give them that, they’ll sit up and take notice – their view counts, possibly for the first time in their young lives...

19 January 2014 at 11:40  

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