Thursday, March 27, 2014

Clegg dismisses Andrew Symeou's Greek hell as "complete fantasy"

Yesterday's Clegg v Farage EU debate on LBC was more entertaining than enlightening. Each swatted the other with hard facts and some tedious stats, and both spouted one or two sentences they may come to regret. According to a snap poll taken by YouGov, Farage beat Clegg by 57% to 36%, which the BBC manage to interpret as a score draw.

But there was one brief exchange which irked His Grace beyond belief.

In the context of the European Arrest Warrant – the agreement which subsumes the English system of Common Law to the Napoleonic system, and permits British citizens to be extradited to another EU country, incarcerated in a foreign prison, refused an early appearance in court and required to prove that you have not committed the offence of which you stand accused – when Nigel Farage raised the appalling experience of Andrew Symeou, Nick Clegg dismissed it as "pure fantasy".

Mr Symeou spent almost a year in a hellish Greek prison accused of killing Jonathan Hiles on the island of Zante in 2007. He was extradited in July 2009 – an innocent young man callously separated from his family and shipped to face trial in a foreign court and rot in a squalid prison with convicted murderers and rapists. There was no presumption of innocence, no Habeas Corpus, no Trial by Jury. Our MPs at Westminster and MEPs in Brussels were powerless to intervene: judicial sovereignty had been ceded.

It took four years for his hearing to commence finally in 2011: the Greek authorities were not trial-ready when they issued the warrant, and nor are they obliged to be. Andrew Symeou even spent his 21st birthday behind bars. It was an appalling miscarriage of justice, and an unimaginable ordeal for the entire Symeou family.

And Nick Clegg grotesquely dismisses this as "complete fantasy".

Corpus Juris has brought an end to the presumption of innocence and the ancient rights of Trial by Jury and Habeas Corpus: unlike the UK, other EU countries are not obliged to charge you or bring you to court within 48 hours of arrest: indeed, you may apparently be detained indefinitely at the foreign prince’s pleasure. And now some Greek laboratory experimenting with your DNA may erroneously find you complicit in an alleged crime, even though your toe has never touched the dust of the Eleftherios Venizelos International Airport. But when the Greek authorities demand your extradition by invoking the European Arrest Warrant, HM Government is absolutely powerless to resist.

None of this, Mr Clegg, is "complete fantasy".

Ask Andrew Symeou.


Blogger Guy Jones said...

Your Grace

The EU is the Trojan horse by which the British people are now subjected to 'continental' systems, which I believe are in the spirit of Antichrist. It was God's blessed providence that kept Napoleon from these shores. Now we toss this away with the contempt of Esau.

27 March 2014 at 10:50  
Blogger David Hussell said...

Nick Clegg cares not one jot for our ancient freedoms under Common Law or true representative national democracy. He unthinkingly rejects facts, logic and common sense and spouts an emotional loyalty to his roots, in continental europe. He is a lost cause, but was a useful foil against which Farage could debate.

The Anglo-Saxon system of common Law is far superior to the Napoleonic Legal system. It's roots go back 2000 years (the Roman writer Tactitus refers), was refined by generations of law makers, and gave the guilty and the innocent far greater protections and justice than the current undemocratic imposition, foisted upon us by stealth and lies, from PM Heath onwards.

For there to be any semblance of open democracy the two other anti-British parties should now engage in debate, explaining, through the use of verifiable facts, how our current course of national extinction, being absorbed within an undemocratic continental empire, anxious for ever more territory, and control over the lives of its citizens, can possibly benefit the long term future of the people of this country

A more equal Chair is needed too for future debates.

Our national choice is either freedom and the chance to build the nation again, or a slow decline becoming a mere region of the EU Empire, with no meaningful democratic sway over big and middle sized decisions, and with all our lives, ordered for the benefit of others, especially Germany and France, but never ourselves.
Renegotiation is a time wasting distraction of a mirage - it is not what the EU is about, and the leaders of our two main traditional parties have neither any fight or guile in them to lead such negotiations. Neither are up to the task. Out is the only way.
My sympathies go to all those like poor Andrew Symeou and his family, who have been abandoned, betrayed by our deliberately weakened legal systems. Injustice and national decline stalk the land as never before. The door was opened by PM Edward Heath, and the door has been held open ever since by successive PM's working to the tune of Brussels. We need our country back.

27 March 2014 at 10:51  
Blogger Ken said...

That lie by Clegg was only one of many. His utterly ridiculous and laughable claim that the EU only sets 7% of our laws, completely excludes the thousands of EU directives which we MUST abide by and set into UK Statute law.

He lied about the population figures, he lied about UKIP wanted to pull up any drawbridge. UKIP want to trade more with the 4 billion + consumers in growing markets outside the EU, in a way that the EU prevents us from doing, in addition to trading with the EU.

We do not have to be run by the EU and lose all ability to control our own borders, to trade globally in a much more prosperous way than we do now.

Farage won that debate by a country mile.

27 March 2014 at 10:55  
Blogger 45minutewarning said...

Nick Clegg telling lies again? Well, there's a surprise!

27 March 2014 at 12:47  
Blogger Integrity said...

Your Grace,
What a shambles Clegg was. What a smoothie of delectable deceits.
David and Ken have got it right above, tell a lie often enough and people will believe it. Millions of Jobs will not be lost by our opting out but we night just get to govern ourselves again. Who in their right mind wants to be governed by an unelected bunch of retards?
Not surprisingly neither of them mention the creeping moral decay of the EU and Clegg got an unhealthy applause for saying how he had supported the 'right' of 'loving couples to express their affection in marriage, no mater their sexuality'. Since when was marriage all about love and affection?

BTW. Have you looked at HG's thermometer of donations recently?
It has stopped just short of being a useful amount. Everyone needs to dig deep to bring HG's project to fruition.

27 March 2014 at 12:51  
Blogger Uncle Brian said...

Your Grace

On the face of it there seems to be a contradiction between the “Greek hell” extradition inflicted on Andrew Symeou and something Farage is quoted as saying in connection with an undeportable Mafia boss. This snippet is from Lloyd Evans’s review (at the Coffee House) of last night’s Nick ’n’ Nigel show:

In any case, he [Farage] added, the present EU rules are dysfunctional. We can’t deport a mafia boss because the jails receiving him in Italy aren’t cosy enough for convicted gangsters.

Is there a legal distinction, for EU purposes, between "extradition" and "deportation"?

27 March 2014 at 13:01  
Blogger Marie1797 said...

The smooth talking spiv Clegg doesn't get it.
I wished Mr Farage had been able to explain more about the EAW's dangers and been able to give a slightly more detailed run down of Andrew Symeou's case. Maybe the the deputy Prime Minister wouldn't have been so quick to dismiss the facts as fantasy.

27 March 2014 at 13:58  
Blogger Ars Hendrik said...

Clegg – an eel dipped in Vaseline, swimming in a can of Duckham's Engine Oil. Not sure I am too attracted to Farage's 'Man of the people' act though, he being a Dulwich College old boy with a shoe-in via dad to the City's money markets. It takes more than a fag and pint of bitter to make a working man.

On policies and fact, though, Farage beat the oleaginous little creep to a pulp.

27 March 2014 at 14:21  
Blogger john in cheshire said...

Mr Clegg is an atheist, so you can't expect much from him regarding accuracy, honesty or concern for his fellow man. I remember that this person could have forced a vote on the Lisbon Treaty, prior to Mr Brown treacherously signing it behind closed doors and slinking away like the thief in the night. But Mr Clegg, for all his assertions that he thinks we should have a say in matters EU, hasn't the slightest intention of letting us have a say. Judge a man by what he does, not what he says. Mr Clegg fails abysmally. He's a thoroughly despicable person; just like his Libdem cohorts.

27 March 2014 at 16:05  
Blogger David Kavanagh said...


"an eel dipped in Vaseline, swimming in a can of Duckham's Engine Oil"

I like that. Permission to add to my lexicon of insulting comebacks and to use it ?

"It takes more than a fag and pint of bitter to make a working man."

Heh, for the non-Brits here, a 'fag' is slang for cigarette, not homosexual (I got into trouble for asking for a rubber in America once, as it refers to condoms, apparently).

27 March 2014 at 16:11  
Blogger E.xtra S.ensory Blofeld + Tiddles said...

Integrity said...

"BTW. Have you looked at HG's thermometer of donations recently?
It has stopped just short of being a useful amount. Everyone needs to dig deep to bring HG's project to fruition."

Indeed, but can't do nowt til end of month as Ernst supposes others are similarly constrained.

Will do something when in funds.

Well exhorted, Integrity.


27 March 2014 at 16:59  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

Happy Jack agrees Clegg is a t*at of the first order.

David, the American's do have some weird words and expressions.

Q. "What is your opinion of American's speaking English?"

A. "I think it would be an excellent idea."


27 March 2014 at 17:00  
Blogger Andrew McCoull said...

John in Cheshire.....don't assume all atheists are like Clegg. Blair is a Christian, but he's more oily than Cameron and Clegg combined. Lack of religious faith does not equate to lack of human feeling.

27 March 2014 at 17:19  
Blogger carl jacobs said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

27 March 2014 at 17:43  
Blogger carl jacobs said...

David Kavanagh

The proper word choice would have been 'eraser' I suspect. This according to the Standard of Spoken & Written English, Version 2.4.17 - which first version was established by act of Congress in 1793 when Americans acquired formal control of the English language.

Lessons are available online if you want to upgrade.


27 March 2014 at 17:44  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Have to be careful here as the blighter currently lives, and one does not wish to be presented with a libel writ.

So , in the Inspector's opinion, Clegg is nothing but an amoral unprincipled political opportunist who has trouble with the definition of truth.

Now, the important thing is this. The many Lib-Dem supporters this man knows are anything but the above. Granted, they do tend to be naively trusting in what they voted for. Hoping for the best, if you will. Well, at least they were and did. The party of the soft protest vote is not that party anymore, as the man himself will discover in a years time.

You know you’ve failed when you’re offered a life peerage at such a young age, don’t you think ?

27 March 2014 at 18:26  
Blogger 45minutewarning said...

Andrew MsCoull @17:19

"Blair is a Christian"

There is a difference between wearing the badge and walking the talk.

As for Clegg, he is a good Marxist-Leninist, I'll give him that. His contempt and intolerance of religious freedom would have made him a valuable asset in the early Soviet Union.

27 March 2014 at 18:40  
Blogger IanCad said...

Happy Jack ' wrote to David:

"--the American's do have some weird words and expressions."

Indeed they do. Imagine my surprise when I moved to South Carolina and discovered that the official state dance was "The Shag."

Somehow I just couldn't get into the swing of it.

27 March 2014 at 19:07  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

IanCad, fancy naming a dance after a pipe tobacco! Only in America.

One Happy Jack finds most strange is 'cremains' for the ashes of a dead body after cremation. Then there's 'deplane' for disembarking from an aeroplane.

27 March 2014 at 20:07  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

.... and 'fanny pack' could cause issues in Britain.


27 March 2014 at 20:11  
Blogger Uncle Brian said...

Happy Jack

Thirty-two years ago Clive James covered Margaret Thatcher’s official visit to China for The Observer. Here is a sentence in his first report from Peking, as it was called then. Notice anything odd about the end of the sentence?

The British Media, who were along for the ride, tumbled down the rear gangway and took up their positions in a tearing hurry, because the War Leader would be among the first of the official party to deplane.

Coincidences happen. These reports from China are reprinted in Reliable Essays, a book I started reading yesterday.

27 March 2014 at 20:40  
Blogger Happy Jack said...

Uncle Brian, yes, well, Clive James is an Aussie.

27 March 2014 at 20:55  
Blogger DanJ0 said...

j.i.c: "Mr Clegg is an atheist, so you can't expect much from him regarding accuracy, honesty or concern for his fellow man."


27 March 2014 at 21:19  
Blogger David Kavanagh said...

Hey Carl,

I'm just a son of an immigrant Iraqi, who speaks Hebrew with an accent from up 'Norf, but lives in the South of England, who has never quite mastered The Queen's Engluish...

Ian Cad,

Fancy naming a dance after a bird.There is nothing like the Southern drewal...

Happy Jack,

*chuckle* indeed.

27 March 2014 at 21:46  
Blogger Inspector General in Ordinary said...

Chin up DanJ0, some atheists are good people. But don’t ask for names...

27 March 2014 at 21:51  
Blogger Len said...

"We must all stick together then we can make a name for ourselves"says Clegg speaking of Europe..Clegg who has bought into the vision where the Godless Union has reached into the Heavens where all can become 'gods' make their own laws and control their own destinies?.

Isn`t this what they said on the Plain in' Shinar?'.

28 March 2014 at 07:23  
Blogger Manfarang said...

Guy Jones
"The EU is the Trojan horse by which the British people are now subjected to 'continental' systems, which I believe are in the spirit of Antichrist"
Some British people have been subject to 'continental" systems for a long time. The Scottish legal system has strong Roman civil law influences.A nation of believers I should add.

28 March 2014 at 08:16  
Blogger Ars Hendrik said...

Hi Kavanagh, (27 March 2014 16:11)

By all mean add to the lexicon – cheers.

'Fag' ah yes, could get into trouble on that one – thanks for the trans-Atlantic translation – I really did mean cigarette, before I am tarred and feathered by the outraged.

28 March 2014 at 09:19  
Blogger Rasher Bacon said...


It is exactly what they said.


Our host seems to have gone beyond the honest thermometer, and has posted that the morality of an organisation is totally unrelated to the responsibility of its supporters to continue funding it.

Ho hum. We all learn in different ways...

When he removes his teeth from Justin Taylor's backside

28 March 2014 at 15:49  
Blogger Michele said...

Is one necessarily debarred from being one of the boys because of the career choice of one's father? What a narrow world you live in.

29 March 2014 at 11:45  

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